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<blockquote data-quote="Ruslanchik" data-source="post: 4285786" data-attributes="member: 45251">I don't own the 4E books, but I have looked through pretty much all of the PHB.&nbsp; Because of this, I have an &quot;impression&quot; of it and that's about it.Based on this impression, I have to say that I dislike both the style and the substance of it.&nbsp; As far as the books go, some of the art is really good, better than the 3.5 PHB, but some of it makes me want to turn the page or play a game that NOT like that.&nbsp; The page layout is not appealing.&nbsp; In the 3.5 books, the pages looked good even it the page was just text or charts.&nbsp; With 4E, the pages are just white so when they fill 6 straight pages with powers I am not compelled to read them.&nbsp; I do not like dragonborn.&nbsp; I think that is just a bad idea and reading the PHB has not made me feel any better about it.&nbsp; They are ugly and they do not look like they fit in the setting with dwarves and elves.&nbsp; Seriously, they got rid of half-orcs (which is one of the coolest RP races) and gnomes for this?&nbsp; Tieflings are a little better, but I think they took the &quot;4E is going to be metal!&quot; thing a little too far.As for substance, I feel like 4E is a minatures game.&nbsp; The combat seems like it is well-balanced and fun, but the options are extremely limited.&nbsp; Basically you can deal damage or you can deal damage and shift or you can deal damage and let one of your allies shift.&nbsp; Seems like lots of good strategy elements, but not good fantasy.&nbsp; 3.5 was great for options at the expense of balance.&nbsp; You could be anything you could imagine and your character might be powerless or powerful.&nbsp; 4E is balance at the expense of options.&nbsp; You can only play a few archetypes, but you will be pretty much at the same power level as the other archetypes you are playing with.&nbsp; I also agree whole-heartedly with the OP about the need for 0-level characters.&nbsp; I used to hate playing 1st level characters in 3.5 because they would die if they tripped over a tree limb.&nbsp; The ubiquitous 1st level wizard with 5hp was a problem.&nbsp; But I do not think that a 1st level wizard should be able to cast unlimited magic missiles.&nbsp;&nbsp; There is no transition from normal folks to heroes to super heroes.&nbsp; There is just superheroes.&nbsp; That goes to style and substance.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Ruslanchik, post: 4285786, member: 45251"] I don't own the 4E books, but I have looked through pretty much all of the PHB. Because of this, I have an "impression" of it and that's about it. Based on this impression, I have to say that I dislike both the style and the substance of it. As far as the books go, some of the art is really good, better than the 3.5 PHB, but some of it makes me want to turn the page or play a game that NOT like that. The page layout is not appealing. In the 3.5 books, the pages looked good even it the page was just text or charts. With 4E, the pages are just white so when they fill 6 straight pages with powers I am not compelled to read them. I do not like dragonborn. I think that is just a bad idea and reading the PHB has not made me feel any better about it. They are ugly and they do not look like they fit in the setting with dwarves and elves. Seriously, they got rid of half-orcs (which is one of the coolest RP races) and gnomes for this? Tieflings are a little better, but I think they took the "4E is going to be metal!" thing a little too far. As for substance, I feel like 4E is a minatures game. The combat seems like it is well-balanced and fun, but the options are extremely limited. Basically you can deal damage or you can deal damage and shift or you can deal damage and let one of your allies shift. Seems like lots of good strategy elements, but not good fantasy. 3.5 was great for options at the expense of balance. You could be anything you could imagine and your character might be powerless or powerful. 4E is balance at the expense of options. You can only play a few archetypes, but you will be pretty much at the same power level as the other archetypes you are playing with. I also agree whole-heartedly with the OP about the need for 0-level characters. I used to hate playing 1st level characters in 3.5 because they would die if they tripped over a tree limb. The ubiquitous 1st level wizard with 5hp was a problem. But I do not think that a 1st level wizard should be able to cast unlimited magic missiles. There is no transition from normal folks to heroes to super heroes. There is just superheroes. That goes to style and substance. [/QUOTE]

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