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*Dungeons & Dragons
Crown of Madness not as bad in play as it seems
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<blockquote data-quote="Gadget" data-source="post: 8399305" data-attributes="member: 23716"><p>I would argue that the spells <em>Crown</em> is being compared to here are far more universally applicable and less situational the <em>Crown</em>, in addition to two of them being 1st level spells compared to <em>Crown</em> being 2nd level. That makes a difference. I would also posit that it is rare that you gain all of the above benefits on a single casting of <em>Crown</em>, especially with all the 'only maintain it for one round' suggestions.</p><p></p><p>I think it does require significant DM cooperation to have all the stars align to get the max benefit from the spell here described, not to mention not just playing the NPCs such to minimize the effectiveness of the spell once cast. Some might argue that is just poor DMing and NPCs should be played according to their type, traits and personality, but it is a temptation I have seen quite a bit over time though. </p><p> </p><p></p><p>While most things in 5e are up for DM interpretation, I don't see any particular need for it with the charmed condition: the target cannot harm or or target the charmer with harmful effects; and the charmer has advantage on ability checks to interact with the target socially. The 'friendly acquaintance' verbiage is unique to the Charm Person spell. </p><p></p><p>There are a lot of assumptions present in this situation. I'm not saying that this does not happen, or even that it might not happen semi regularly. But it is not an assured thing. You have to have a target next to an ally that is also engaged with your party. So far, a fairly common occurrence. Then, it must be worth your action, concentration and a second level spell slot to have the target potentially spend their action to to make an attack against their companion. Even then, the target can move away from an ally without taking an Opportunity Attack by just moving to the side without moving out of reach of a foe. Or the ally could be the one moving away from the crazy guy with the glowing crown, perhaps in a similar manner if Opportunity Attacks are an issue. Finally, would eating an OA (which is not guaranteed to hit) worth the cost of the spell and action used to cast it? Maybe. </p><p></p><p>It is a very thoughtful and tactical approach to the game, and all have provided good points on how to use the spell well. Some may not want to get into that detail and just want a more direct effect though.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Gadget, post: 8399305, member: 23716"] I would argue that the spells [I]Crown[/I] is being compared to here are far more universally applicable and less situational the [I]Crown[/I], in addition to two of them being 1st level spells compared to [I]Crown[/I] being 2nd level. That makes a difference. I would also posit that it is rare that you gain all of the above benefits on a single casting of [I]Crown[/I], especially with all the 'only maintain it for one round' suggestions. I think it does require significant DM cooperation to have all the stars align to get the max benefit from the spell here described, not to mention not just playing the NPCs such to minimize the effectiveness of the spell once cast. Some might argue that is just poor DMing and NPCs should be played according to their type, traits and personality, but it is a temptation I have seen quite a bit over time though. While most things in 5e are up for DM interpretation, I don't see any particular need for it with the charmed condition: the target cannot harm or or target the charmer with harmful effects; and the charmer has advantage on ability checks to interact with the target socially. The 'friendly acquaintance' verbiage is unique to the Charm Person spell. There are a lot of assumptions present in this situation. I'm not saying that this does not happen, or even that it might not happen semi regularly. But it is not an assured thing. You have to have a target next to an ally that is also engaged with your party. So far, a fairly common occurrence. Then, it must be worth your action, concentration and a second level spell slot to have the target potentially spend their action to to make an attack against their companion. Even then, the target can move away from an ally without taking an Opportunity Attack by just moving to the side without moving out of reach of a foe. Or the ally could be the one moving away from the crazy guy with the glowing crown, perhaps in a similar manner if Opportunity Attacks are an issue. Finally, would eating an OA (which is not guaranteed to hit) worth the cost of the spell and action used to cast it? Maybe. It is a very thoughtful and tactical approach to the game, and all have provided good points on how to use the spell well. Some may not want to get into that detail and just want a more direct effect though. [/QUOTE]
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