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Message: <blockquote data-quote="aramis erak" data-source="post: 9852017" data-attributes="member: 6779310">That shift predates 2E by YEARS...  just look at the Palladium XP gains tables from 1981's The Mechanoids.Note that, while I own a dead tree of the original version, and have checked it against the reprint, I actually copied from the reprint, knowing, error included, its accurate to the original 1981.Or, at least, to the printing I have, which, by now, is probably red text on red paper...Siembieda was reacting to the 1970's D&D (not sure even if he'd seen AD&D yet) when he wrote his mechanics.In his rant which precedes the list, he completely overlooks the XP for gold retrieved/acquired in play... when asked about it in the past he's mentioned that his friend group ignored that rule by 1978... I don't consider KS a reliable narrator, but his rants in rules are a fixed point, and what he chose to emphasize in his "not quite D&D" rulesystem, and what he chose to rant about around it, spotlights what he saw.Tunnels and Trolls§1.9 Adventure Points...Daring: 100 per level of dungeonSaving Rolls: Level of save × actual roll on the dice (counting open ending).GM call for doing "something unusual, even foolhardy."Combat: MR or sum of attributes for defeat. GM call if shared or if awarded full to all.Casting Magic: 1 per ST spent.Treasure and Magic Items:"Once upon a time experience points weregiven for treasure and magical items found andcarried off, but no longer! Properly speaking, cashis its own reward , and there is no reason why acharacter who stumbles across a diamond worth10,000 GP, picks it up and walks off, should get10,000 ex perience points."So, by 1979, several game designers were ranting against the use of XP for treasure in RPGs.Meanwhile, others, like Stephan Michael Sechi and Vernie Taylor, authors of The Arcanum (which I have 2nd of, 1985) were still doing monster and treasure XP... but had an extensive list of other things, such as religious conversions, non-magical successful influence of NPCs, rescuing NPCs...And then there was Rolemaster... the 1982 version with XP for distance, XP for every roll, XP for every hit taken or inflicted, oen for ever SP spent casting for adventure effects, XP for every critical taken... there's a fracking worksheet for it. And it firmly puts the onus on the player to track it.The GM gets to give bonus XP...So D&D was merely catching up with the Joneses with AD&D's move to adding non-combat non-treaure XP... but still allowed treasure XP, even as many GMs houseruled it away, and many other games marginalized treasure XP.Makes me wonder what the XP award table looks like.</blockquote>

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