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<blockquote data-quote="Celtavian" data-source="post: 6642203" data-attributes="member: 5834">Did you really just write that? I can play your little game as well. Here's what was actually said since we're putting words in each other's mouths:Celtavian: &quot;Here's why the feats work the way they do. Because a single hit does about equal to two hits from a regular attack. A single hit is about 80% higher than a non-GWF hit. If a group focuses on using it under optimal conditions, it will do about 80% more damage.&quot;Dave Dash: &quot;Here's data from fights showing how it works under optimal conditions.&quot;Coredump: &quot;That's bad math. My math while using the feat all the time, never not using it, shows it's only 12%. That's if use it all the time with both of the characters using the same stuff. You know. All the time regardless of AC.&quot;Celtavian: &quot;It's impossible to model that with white room math given the vast number of situations. You can only show why a single hit is so far ahead of a non-GWF hits. You can show the immediate trade off and list some of the conditions that allow the tradeoff to work in favor the GWF.&quot;Coredump; &quot;My great math with no data shows 12%. I will put your words in quotation marks to show how bad the math is.&quot;Dave: &quot;Here is more actual data from play showing you the real numbers in play.&quot;Celtavian: &quot;Only focus on the difference in a single round of hits. The rest is too variable to calculate. The feat is only used under optimal conditions.&quot;Coredump: &quot;Bad &quot;math.&quot; Like I said, it doesn't work like your math shows it works. Been proven on multiple threads you appear to be ignoring. I can't continue a discussion with a guy that ignores what has already been clearly proven.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celtavian, post: 6642203, member: 5834"] Did you really just write that? I can play your little game as well. Here's what was actually said since we're putting words in each other's mouths: Celtavian: "Here's why the feats work the way they do. Because a single hit does about equal to two hits from a regular attack. A single hit is about 80% higher than a non-GWF hit. If a group focuses on using it under optimal conditions, it will do about 80% more damage." Dave Dash: "Here's data from fights showing how it works under optimal conditions." Coredump: "That's bad math. My math while using the feat all the time, never not using it, shows it's only 12%. That's if use it all the time with both of the characters using the same stuff. You know. All the time regardless of AC." Celtavian: "It's impossible to model that with white room math given the vast number of situations. You can only show why a single hit is so far ahead of a non-GWF hits. You can show the immediate trade off and list some of the conditions that allow the tradeoff to work in favor the GWF." Coredump; "My great math with no data shows 12%. I will put your words in quotation marks to show how bad the math is." Dave: "Here is more actual data from play showing you the real numbers in play." Celtavian: "Only focus on the difference in a single round of hits. The rest is too variable to calculate. The feat is only used under optimal conditions." Coredump: "Bad "math." Like I said, it doesn't work like your math shows it works. Been proven on multiple threads you appear to be ignoring. I can't continue a discussion with a guy that ignores what has already been clearly proven. [/QUOTE]

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