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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crimson Longinus" data-source="post: 9480325" data-attributes="member: 7025508">Could people drop "but not all warlocks" thing that makes the discussion to go into circles? It doesn't matter.a) Making deals for power with questionable entities is the core for warlock identity. This is relationship that is liable to produce more conflict, than say, a cleric deciding to worship a god whose tenets they agree with. And the text recognises this too and mentions warlocks working against the patron. That this is not the only way warlock/patron relationship can work, is is besides the point. This is a common way to play warlocks, so it will come up.b) Even if the patron was perfectly friendly, the expectation would still be that the GM plays them like they play every other NPC. You can do it otherwise of course, but there really is not confusion about how D&D expects NPCs to be operated.c) Even if the GM plays the patron, the player can of course still contribute to brainstorming the patron, as it is part of their character's background. It is just that if they choose the patron at level three like the book suggests, this is a tad more difficult.It is easier for the GM to incorporate the player's ideas if they know from the get go what they are!d) If the patron can refuse to teach the warlock further powers or even take away existing ones, this of course is not for the purposes of the GM bullying the player into playing their character in certain way. It is just one possible concrete stake for the pact, which can be used to create dramatic conflict. I think Wyll's story in Baldur's Gate III is a decent example about how this could be utilised.e) Paladin entry actually explain what happens if there is a conflict with their power source. I think it is weird and inconsistent that other classes do not, especially the warlock, for which potential for such conflict is inbuilt and even offered as an example in the text. This might put inexperienced GMs in situations, where they now have a conflict between the warlock and their supposed power source, but no guidance on how to handle it.</blockquote>

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