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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 9504134" data-attributes="member: 87792">Believe it or not 0.1% of the entire population is not any sort of statistical threshold. If we assume the playerbase to be uniform I'm waaaay past a 99% threshold for it being just luck. Which means that either the local environment is very different (which is possible) or that skill matters (again possible).This doesn't follow. I'm good and know I'm good. I'm just not some sort of paragon, just someone still learning.This doesn't follow either.It's not about me - but I do have fairly wide ranging experience.Spoing! My irony meter just exploded after your last comment. You're explicitly saying that your experience is irrelevant to anyone else.The only conclusion therefore is that what you point out is nothing to do with anyone else.And I am answering that. Fix it at source - with the DMing problems that lead to it. And then I am suggesting how.You simply don't like this answer.And this is a strawman. I have never said there are no bad players. I have simply said that complaints about this specific problem flows from the DM. I have never seen a non-DM make this complaint about their fellow players; it is a problem that 100% exists on the Player/DM interaction axis and that means that there are always two people involved of which one is always the DM.What? That you're commenting on irony?What's under discussion is an interaciton problem. It's simply that you are sticking your fingers in your ears and screaming how it must be the other guy, not even considering that it takes two people to have a problem.You literally quoted me pointing out that bad and toxic are not the same thing in the exact same post you are replying to. You can't even claim you didn't read that sentence in my reply. You are just lashing out here.Which means that no further conversation can be productive.This is just you attempting to deflect. "Tyrrany of fun" players are a problem with the player/DM interaction. I've pointed out where I believe it lies - with DMing practice. This is entirely in line with the conversation. And believe it or not fixing DMing practice is something you have much more control over than the player side of the interaction.Deflection is right - but it's not mine.The very next sentence you quoted after this one was "I haven't said that. Especially as bad and toxic aren't the same thing. But part of the DM's job is helping players grow."You know perfectly well that I don't think that there are no bad players and I have mentioned that I have had to remove toxic players. You are just throwing as much chaff as you can here to avoid the question as to where the actual problem lies.I'm imbuing DMs with responsibility. And it's not a separate discussion; it's part of the same one.But it's clear that you are trying to shout me down and are either not reading what I am writing or you are intentionally strawmanning it.  There is no point in continuing this further.Goodbye</blockquote>

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