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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 9438184" data-attributes="member: 7030563">I do miss using those spells, but no the bad design is having 4 separate class abilities centered around a specific spell that some players will rarely use, ESPECIALLY when one of them is the freaking capstone.It is supposed to be the Ranger class, not the Hunter's Mark class.The problem is with the Ranger class, not any of these things.Since you bought it up though, at high level it is going to be pretty hard for the FW to do what the subclass is designed to do (Summon Fey and charm/frighten) and at the time get much benefits out of all those ranger class abilities that are centered on HM.No.  If they took away PA I would be fine.  My problem is Favored Enemy, Relentless Hunter, Precise Hunter and Foe Slayer.  They all revolve around one spell.No it isn't.  To start with Nature's Veil happens later in the new Ranger and it conflicts with HM.Second Favored Foe, the way I used it was a lot better.  Not a little better, a lot better.  It did not require a bonus action meaning I could use Nature's Veil, TWF or Misty Step on the same turn.  I did not attack enough to use up the daily uses of it, so I could spam it on every single hit.  Also it was 1d8 at that level so it did MORE damage than HM, not less, and I could also use it on multiple targets in the same turn (although I don't know that I ever did that late in game).  As long as I was not already concentrating on something it was a flat 1d8 I could add to any attack I wanted.I mentioned above that in one fight against an enemy in an anti-magic shell that I decimated him.  I did that by using Two Weapon Fighting going and attacking twice with my dragontooth dagger, once with my other dagger (+1 or +2??) and using multiple uses of fovored foe to add 1d8 damage to every one of those hits (and sneak attack and dreadful strikes).  Hunter's Mark would have been about 15 damage less on the first round and a smaller amount less (3) on the 2nd round and that is IF it would have worked inside an anti-magic zone at all (which I doubt it would have).In this debate, let's remember that this character actually had Hex too (from Fey Touched), and FF was MUCH better for damage at high level given the rarity of her making attacks and the action economy.  Hex was used entirely for the disadvantage mechanic after 10th level or so, even though I had a free casting, and this was because Favored Foe was better every time I had concentration open and wanted to do damage.  TBH if I did it again I would take Dissonant Whispers instead of Hex and I did this on the Dragonborn Chromescale which I played after the Goblin Lena.It is not less at this level.  It is more.But she needs to use the HM Bonus action, giving up an attack .... and she would not have had it anyway because that comes at 17th level and she was a level 16 Ranger.Chromescale would have had it, but he did not attack with a weapon at all, not one time, after level 15.  Although I will point out that if he did, at 20th level he would have lost 5DPR to his attacks because the capstone is now Hunters Mark.It is not better, it is worse for that other playstyle.No.  Let's be clear here.They lost:Primal Awareness,Favored foe (much better than HM for this playstyle)Nature's Viel was moved laterVanishold Foe Slayer.All of these would be better than the abilities they replaced them with for this particular play style.What is nonsense is this claim.  It is factually and objectively true they had more than one feature replaced by these Hunter's Mark buffs.If you are a character that is goiong to be hitting it with a stick the new Ranger is better.  If you are a PC that is going to be pumping wisdom, summoning or throwing down spike growth and spending a lot of time casting (and concentrating) on something else the new Ranger is worse.  Especially at high levels.Overall the class is more powerful, but the playstyle I used, and a fair number of players used, is punished in the new class design and not well supported in class mechanics like it was previously.  That doesn't mean it won't work, but it is not supported by the class mechanics.The Ranger has 40 different concentration spells (not counting subclass adds).  Many of them are objectively more powerful than Hunter's Mark.  I have to forgo using 39 of them to make use of my 1st, 13th, 17th or 20th level class features.  That is the problem</blockquote>

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