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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 660526" data-attributes="member: 3146">Nice try but not even close. Assuming an absolute  best case scenario:Transmuter 16, Int 30, Dex 24, greater spell penetration, greater spell focus Transmutation, improved initiative, point blank shot, precise shot, Heighten Spell and weapon focus: ray.Round 1 Heightened Disintegrate (attack bonus +17 w/in 30' (DC 32)) followed by Quickened polymorph other DC 28.Step 1: Hit with the Disintegrate (95% chance)Step 2: beat SR. The character has only a 45% chance of defeating SR with each spell.Step 2: get him to fail his save. The pit fiend needs to roll a 13 to make the first save (40% chance) and a 9 to make the second save (60% chance).So the odds of the pit fiend succumbing to the disintegrate is 26%. The odds of him succumbing to the polymorph other is 18%. The odds of getting him with one or the other is 39%. (Although maybe we shouldn't count the polymorph other because even as a newt, the pit fiend can still summon Baatezu, Mass Hold Monster, and Meteor Swarm the party). However, by this point we're discussing a character with godly stats (natural int 18 and dex 18 with +6 enhancement items for both, 4 stat increases in int and a +2 inherent bonus to int). We're also looking at a character who's specifically designed to disintegrate outsiders. And who burns through at least half of his highest level spells. If we drop him back just a little (assume that he has item creation feats instead of Greater spell penetration and greater spell focus) the chance of taking out the pit fiend in round 1 goes down to 17.5% and we're still talking about a highly optimized character--optimized for this specific scenario.Take a character who started out with a 16 int and a 14 dex (pretty reasonable stats for most campaigns) and didn't get an inherent bonus. Now there's only a 12% chance of the pit fiend going down to a round 1 instant death spell. If PCs are taking odds like that (or even like the hyper-optimized wizard's 26% chance) they're pretty desperate.Take a creature with AC 25, 2 attacks per round at +15/+10 for 1d12+8 damage, 2 HD and 30 hit points, and saves of +10/+10/+10. Using the logic you're using on this pit fiend, I could call it CR 1 because it's got a 30% chance of going down to a 1st level wizard's (int 18, with spell focus) sleep or color spray in round 1. As Porgy and Bess sing, "It ain't necessarily so."</blockquote>

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