Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
D&D 4.0 - What the?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Humanophile" data-source="post: 1327188" data-attributes="member: 1049"><p>Yeah, I'd like to have 4e be a perfectly balanced, flexible point-based system with spontaneous, skill based magic. And in the words of Susie Derkins, while I'm at it, I'd like a pony.</p><p></p><p>Realistically speaking in terms of what designers and playtesters can handle, I'd like to see the following changes:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Alignment will probably have to stay, but make it easier for those of us who don't like it to ignore it, and give a little more definition to each term. I don't care if that last step ends up being designer rants on the webpage, I just want the system cleaned up and easier to cut out for those of us who don't like it.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">No core class is to have less than a d6 for hit points, or 4 skill points per level. Yes, the classes as-is are <em>balanced</em>, but I'd like to see some more staying power and flexibility built in.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A point-based stat system shown in the PHB, right by the rolling system (which I think should stay the same). Make it more of an "official option".</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Keep the Vancian casters, but shuffle them off to a corner. All official spellcaster examples should use Hennet instead of Mialee, for example. Just try to subtly encourage the more "realistic" (well, popular in fantasy, anyways) sorcerous standard.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A simple VP/WP system, both to cut down on healer-reliance, and to make first level characters less fragile (think Hackmaster's 20 hitpoint kicker). I don't think "this is your kind of banged up hit points, this is your hurtin' badly hit points" is that hard to keep in mind, either.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Acknowledge that different levels of play can vary immensely in genre. Have at least a small segment in the DMG devoted to that fact, as well as sustaining power level/character level/genre if everyone at the table sees fit</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">At the same time, encourage people to start at higher than first level. First level is for newbies and to give characters a prologue. If all you want is to kick ass and take names, starting at first level does nobody any good.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Three "base" classes; the Fighter, the Rogue, and the Sorcerer. These should be your flexible gold standards, and the first classes worked on. (Your typical fighting guy, skill guy, magic guy split.) The PHB should come with some minor variations on the theme, filling out your Rangers, Barbarians, Wizards, Bards, etc. However, try to make sure that any concept you can think of, short of the real wierdos, can be reached by some combination of the three bases.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Some form of hero/fate/whatever point system to encourage feats of daring-do and give players a little meta-game control over what happens after that twenty-sided hits the table.</li> </ul><p></p><p>And finally, AeroDM brings up a good point, but only in a roundabout way. A game like Vampire sells mostly on its setting and plot. D&D, at least in the core books, should be your most generic, vanilla fantasy game out there, chock full of "options, not restrictions". That includes silly little things like the Monk and Paladin multiclass restrictions. However, shortly after the core book bundle comes out, you should have both a line analogous to the Complete* series come out (complete with a couple of new core classes, a handful of generic prestige classes, feats, goodies, and advice, as well as options a'la the spell-less Paladin and Ranger, as well as reccomended restrictions and changes to suit a particular flavor), as well as a campaign setting designed specifically to drip with flavor, again packed with specific monsters, PrC's, goodies, and restrictions to keep characters in-genre.</p><p></p><p>Oh, and while I'm on my own 4e wish list, I'd also like there to be some sort of "designer diary" put out, even if only via the WOTC webpage for a limited time, chock-full of "behind the curtains", cutting-room-floor leavings, and reasons why certain things were picked. Of course, I would've loved one from the 3e design team, but that's not likely at the moment. Still, it'd be a nifty collectable.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Humanophile, post: 1327188, member: 1049"] Yeah, I'd like to have 4e be a perfectly balanced, flexible point-based system with spontaneous, skill based magic. And in the words of Susie Derkins, while I'm at it, I'd like a pony. Realistically speaking in terms of what designers and playtesters can handle, I'd like to see the following changes: [list] [*]Alignment will probably have to stay, but make it easier for those of us who don't like it to ignore it, and give a little more definition to each term. I don't care if that last step ends up being designer rants on the webpage, I just want the system cleaned up and easier to cut out for those of us who don't like it. [*]No core class is to have less than a d6 for hit points, or 4 skill points per level. Yes, the classes as-is are [i]balanced[/i], but I'd like to see some more staying power and flexibility built in. [*]A point-based stat system shown in the PHB, right by the rolling system (which I think should stay the same). Make it more of an "official option". [*]Keep the Vancian casters, but shuffle them off to a corner. All official spellcaster examples should use Hennet instead of Mialee, for example. Just try to subtly encourage the more "realistic" (well, popular in fantasy, anyways) sorcerous standard. [*]A simple VP/WP system, both to cut down on healer-reliance, and to make first level characters less fragile (think Hackmaster's 20 hitpoint kicker). I don't think "this is your kind of banged up hit points, this is your hurtin' badly hit points" is that hard to keep in mind, either. [*]Acknowledge that different levels of play can vary immensely in genre. Have at least a small segment in the DMG devoted to that fact, as well as sustaining power level/character level/genre if everyone at the table sees fit [*]At the same time, encourage people to start at higher than first level. First level is for newbies and to give characters a prologue. If all you want is to kick ass and take names, starting at first level does nobody any good. [*]Three "base" classes; the Fighter, the Rogue, and the Sorcerer. These should be your flexible gold standards, and the first classes worked on. (Your typical fighting guy, skill guy, magic guy split.) The PHB should come with some minor variations on the theme, filling out your Rangers, Barbarians, Wizards, Bards, etc. However, try to make sure that any concept you can think of, short of the real wierdos, can be reached by some combination of the three bases. [*]Some form of hero/fate/whatever point system to encourage feats of daring-do and give players a little meta-game control over what happens after that twenty-sided hits the table. [/list] And finally, AeroDM brings up a good point, but only in a roundabout way. A game like Vampire sells mostly on its setting and plot. D&D, at least in the core books, should be your most generic, vanilla fantasy game out there, chock full of "options, not restrictions". That includes silly little things like the Monk and Paladin multiclass restrictions. However, shortly after the core book bundle comes out, you should have both a line analogous to the Complete* series come out (complete with a couple of new core classes, a handful of generic prestige classes, feats, goodies, and advice, as well as options a'la the spell-less Paladin and Ranger, as well as reccomended restrictions and changes to suit a particular flavor), as well as a campaign setting designed specifically to drip with flavor, again packed with specific monsters, PrC's, goodies, and restrictions to keep characters in-genre. Oh, and while I'm on my own 4e wish list, I'd also like there to be some sort of "designer diary" put out, even if only via the WOTC webpage for a limited time, chock-full of "behind the curtains", cutting-room-floor leavings, and reasons why certain things were picked. Of course, I would've loved one from the 3e design team, but that's not likely at the moment. Still, it'd be a nifty collectable. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
D&D 4.0 - What the?
Top