Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8273016" data-attributes="member: 82106">There's a sentiment/theory that all the trivial stuff about the Ancient Red Dragon matters, because that is all fodder for, basically, CAW! So, the fact (at least asserted by the post you responded to) that 4e cannot handle an Ancient Red Dragon forging a document to trick the PCs into an ambush is a big problem. That is if it cannot handle it straight up by applying the stat block and the skill rules and assuming that the dragon needs to make checks at DCs in the same fashion as a PC would. And you know what I will say next, this is all a reflection of the basic core assumption being made by all 'process game' adherents, which is the core game assumptions that were established by Gary in 1973 in Greyhawk where he was an opponent and a referee and everything was a wargame like test of skill. It was logical, it made sense. The dragon was equivalent to a PC because they were all 'pogs' in a game where the DM was simply playing his side to give the players a challenge. The rules have to produce cognizable results in this model too, because there isn't any resolution framework beyond simple checks (of some sort). So, for the players to reason about the game and their odds, they must be able to think "well, how possible is it, fictionally, for the dragon to forge this document." and then the actual mechanics have to deliver a similar range of results! None of this is relevant to the type of 4e you and I will run where the rules reference informing the fiction and a dragon and a PC are entirely different things. I simply imagine this would be cool for a dragon to do, and set a DC for the PCs to see through it, based on appropriate DCs for their level. I might integrate it into an SC, but either way I don't need mechanics for Dragons forging documents. Though I am not sure why it was stated that such don't exist or are unworkable. 4e retains enough of previous edition baggage that it DOES put skill bonuses into stat blocks. I guess maybe the complaint was they are too low? Perhaps. If so, you can always assume some training/magic/power which improves the outcome, or that the Dragon has a forger on staff (some otherwise irrelevant hireling probably).</blockquote>

Verification