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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 8607079" data-attributes="member: 22779">Again, there is a very large difference between &quot;This simulation is very vague and doesn't supply much information&quot; and &quot;This system supplies no information at all.&quot;&nbsp; As [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] mentioned, taking a piece in Chess is not a simulation of anything.&nbsp; Nothing in chess is meant as a simulation of anything.&nbsp; Same as poker.&nbsp; A poker hand doesn't represent anything at all other than what it means inside the game of Poker.&nbsp; A simulation, at the most basic level, MUST represent something.&nbsp; And in order to represent something it has to tell you some information about that thing.&nbsp; But, D&amp;D doesn't.&nbsp; Levels are a pure gamist element that don't simulate anything.&nbsp; No one gets to be a better blacksmith by killing orcs.&nbsp; Hit points and Hit Dice are fantastic game elements that are tons of fun - and the fact that so many other games copy the system shows just how fun it is - but, they don't actually represent anything.&nbsp; They don't mean anything.&nbsp; Virtually nothing in D&amp;D actually has any sort of correlation to the in game fiction.&nbsp; That's because D&amp;D isn't a simulation.&nbsp; It's not supposed to have correlation.&nbsp; It's not supposed to tell you anything, any more than taking a knight with your pawn tells you anything.&nbsp; Of course players react to the loss of HP, becuase the PLAYER knows these things.&nbsp; But since the loss of HP, or the gain of HP or the gaining of a level doesn't actually tell you anything, it's not a simulation of anything.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 8607079, member: 22779"] Again, there is a very large difference between "This simulation is very vague and doesn't supply much information" and "This system supplies no information at all." As [USER=42582]@pemerton[/USER] mentioned, taking a piece in Chess is not a simulation of anything. Nothing in chess is meant as a simulation of anything. Same as poker. A poker hand doesn't represent anything at all other than what it means inside the game of Poker. A simulation, at the most basic level, MUST represent something. And in order to represent something it has to tell you some information about that thing. But, D&D doesn't. Levels are a pure gamist element that don't simulate anything. No one gets to be a better blacksmith by killing orcs. Hit points and Hit Dice are fantastic game elements that are tons of fun - and the fact that so many other games copy the system shows just how fun it is - but, they don't actually represent anything. They don't mean anything. Virtually nothing in D&D actually has any sort of correlation to the in game fiction. That's because D&D isn't a simulation. It's not supposed to have correlation. It's not supposed to tell you anything, any more than taking a knight with your pawn tells you anything. Of course players react to the loss of HP, becuase the PLAYER knows these things. But since the loss of HP, or the gain of HP or the gaining of a level doesn't actually tell you anything, it's not a simulation of anything. [/QUOTE]

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