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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Thomas Shey" data-source="post: 8621053" data-attributes="member: 7026617">Well, here we are then.  While the two elements I mentioned can be in a bit of dynamic tension, they're still both clearly about the game functioning as a game to me, and don't have much of anything to do with ensuring proper the setting works properly, or making for a better dramatic process (unless you're position is that system transparency and speed is a priori a need in that, and that's one where I think someone pushing it is on shaky ground).  I'm willing to accept arguments that there are other possible agendas but it seems like system flow and enjoyment are clearly in the same bucket to me; just because its one agenda doesn't mean it can't have multiple parts that are in conflict.  After all, actual board games have that same conflict, and I don't think anyone would argue their primary functions aren't as games.</blockquote>