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D&D lovers who hate Vancian magic
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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 5787233" data-attributes="member: 4937"><p>A good point, and one I should have thought of. </p><p></p><p>Yes, this illustrates the problem well. A character that is a level 10 cleric and level 10 wizard (in 3e) is very weak, because 5th level spells in no way are comparable to 7th or 9th level spells and wouldn't be even if you had more spells. Therefore, in order to allow multiclassing between two spellcasting classes you have to have a mechanism which allows you to be almost as high of spellcasting level in both classes as you would be in one. Indeed, the problem shows up with multiclassing a spellcasting class with any non-spellcasting class as well, in that you end up with spells that are too weak to make you an effective spellcaster and combat skills to weak to make you effective in combat. </p><p></p><p>Unfortunately, 3e kludged this together with a an endless variaty of 'prestige classes', one for fighters+arcane casters, another for theives+arcane casters, another for arcane caster+divine casters, another for bards specifically+divine casters, and so on and so on. It was a very ugly system.</p><p></p><p>More low level spells is weaker than fewer higher level spells in the vast majority of cases. So conversely, trading up your low level spell slots for higher ones tends to be stronger.</p><p></p><p>Looking at this in another way, it's not a 'fair trade' and bad for the system if a Psion could trade a reduction in the number of power points he has for greater effective manifestor level. It probably would be unbalancing as well as bad for game play (because the Psion if used optimally, would also always need to rest).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 5787233, member: 4937"] A good point, and one I should have thought of. Yes, this illustrates the problem well. A character that is a level 10 cleric and level 10 wizard (in 3e) is very weak, because 5th level spells in no way are comparable to 7th or 9th level spells and wouldn't be even if you had more spells. Therefore, in order to allow multiclassing between two spellcasting classes you have to have a mechanism which allows you to be almost as high of spellcasting level in both classes as you would be in one. Indeed, the problem shows up with multiclassing a spellcasting class with any non-spellcasting class as well, in that you end up with spells that are too weak to make you an effective spellcaster and combat skills to weak to make you effective in combat. Unfortunately, 3e kludged this together with a an endless variaty of 'prestige classes', one for fighters+arcane casters, another for theives+arcane casters, another for arcane caster+divine casters, another for bards specifically+divine casters, and so on and so on. It was a very ugly system. More low level spells is weaker than fewer higher level spells in the vast majority of cases. So conversely, trading up your low level spell slots for higher ones tends to be stronger. Looking at this in another way, it's not a 'fair trade' and bad for the system if a Psion could trade a reduction in the number of power points he has for greater effective manifestor level. It probably would be unbalancing as well as bad for game play (because the Psion if used optimally, would also always need to rest). [/QUOTE]
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