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<blockquote data-quote="johnnype" data-source="post: 4418984" data-attributes="member: 1944">Forgive me if this doesn't make a lot of sense. It's more of a stream of thought without a cogent or wellformed thesis. What do I mean when I say D&amp;D needs to grow up? I'm not talking about the rules. I'm referring to the artwork, fiction and the feel of the game.The game needs to drop the teen mentality it's had for years and get serious. It needs to lose the veneer of Saturday morning cartoon and get some dirt underneath it's nails. It needs to ramp up the brutality that is &quot;killing monsters&quot; and facing horrors from another plane. It needs to go from a game for kids to a game for adults.Life in any D&amp;D setting should be nasty, brutish and short. The artwork, fiction and setting material should reflect that. Currently it's PG or PG-13 at best and that just doesn't cut it anymore. To steal a term used elsewhere, it needs to be &quot;grittified&quot; the way Battlestar Galactica has when compared to the original series for example.Admittedly WotC has done that with the introduction of the &quot;points of light&quot; idea that has been much discussed and that's all well and good. I'm just not seeing it in the artwork or fiction anywhere. Sure there are nasty looking monsters and there is plenty of artwork showing &quot;heroes&quot; battling &quot;evil&quot;. Yet I see no blood. I see no dead bodies. I see no poverty or misery. I see too many heroes winning the day and living far too long to fight another day. I don't really know if I'm making much sense here so feel free to tear this post apart. I guess if I wanted to boil it down to it's essence I want D&amp;D to have all the grit of A Game of Thrones but with all the magic and monsters that D&amp;D allows. I know a large part of that is in the hands of the DM but it would be very helpful and evocative if the published materials also reflected something a little less adolescent and more in line with the existing audience. Just a thought.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="johnnype, post: 4418984, member: 1944"] Forgive me if this doesn't make a lot of sense. It's more of a stream of thought without a cogent or wellformed thesis. What do I mean when I say D&D needs to grow up? I'm not talking about the rules. I'm referring to the artwork, fiction and the feel of the game. The game needs to drop the teen mentality it's had for years and get serious. It needs to lose the veneer of Saturday morning cartoon and get some dirt underneath it's nails. It needs to ramp up the brutality that is "killing monsters" and facing horrors from another plane. It needs to go from a game for kids to a game for adults. Life in any D&D setting should be nasty, brutish and short. The artwork, fiction and setting material should reflect that. Currently it's PG or PG-13 at best and that just doesn't cut it anymore. To steal a term used elsewhere, it needs to be "grittified" the way Battlestar Galactica has when compared to the original series for example. Admittedly WotC has done that with the introduction of the "points of light" idea that has been much discussed and that's all well and good. I'm just not seeing it in the artwork or fiction anywhere. Sure there are nasty looking monsters and there is plenty of artwork showing "heroes" battling "evil". Yet I see no blood. I see no dead bodies. I see no poverty or misery. I see too many heroes winning the day and living far too long to fight another day. I don't really know if I'm making much sense here so feel free to tear this post apart. I guess if I wanted to boil it down to it's essence I want D&D to have all the grit of A Game of Thrones but with all the magic and monsters that D&D allows. I know a large part of that is in the hands of the DM but it would be very helpful and evocative if the published materials also reflected something a little less adolescent and more in line with the existing audience. Just a thought. [/QUOTE]

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