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<blockquote data-quote="El Mahdi" data-source="post: 5915962" data-attributes="member: 59506">I understood your point, and I understood that you see them as intertwined.&nbsp;I simply disagree that this is so (that they are intertwined).&nbsp;Not all players are concerned with the design skills of their DM. I'd go as far as to say that most players wouldn't even notice the presence or lack of such skills. They're just there to play and hang out. There are likely more players that take D&amp;D significantly less seriously than those of us here do. Those that post on such RPG forums as here, are most likely the minority of those that play D&amp;D (or all RPG's collectively).&nbsp;So, I do believe that DM's lacking design skills can retain players, and do so long term.&nbsp;And even in situations where such a DM can't retain players, there are places with lots of available players. Only one example, but a high turnover rate would allow a DM to play long term, even if a lack of design skills was the cause of their losing players. Not everyone who plays D&amp;D is lucky enough to have groups that remain stable for long periods of time. I don't know what the exact average a group lasts is, but I'd bet it's somewhere around only one or two years. And that's not always a matter of having a bad DM. Groups have turnover for lots of reasons. One such example would be my experience being in the military. It meant I and everyone I gamed with would move every couple to a few years.&nbsp;&nbsp;As to the rest of your post, I see this as going nowhere good very fast. So I'm out.&nbsp;Enjoy the rest of the thread, and I'll see you around the forums.&nbsp;<img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/glasses.png"&nbsp; class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt="B-)" title="Glasses&nbsp; &nbsp; B-)" data-shortname="B-)" /></blockquote>

[QUOTE="El Mahdi, post: 5915962, member: 59506"] I understood your point, and I understood that you see them as intertwined. I simply disagree that this is so (that they are intertwined). Not all players are concerned with the design skills of their DM. I'd go as far as to say that most players wouldn't even notice the presence or lack of such skills. They're just there to play and hang out. There are likely more players that take D&D significantly less seriously than those of us here do. Those that post on such RPG forums as here, are most likely the minority of those that play D&D (or all RPG's collectively). So, I do believe that DM's lacking design skills can retain players, and do so long term. And even in situations where such a DM can't retain players, there are places with lots of available players. Only one example, but a high turnover rate would allow a DM to play long term, even if a lack of design skills was the cause of their losing players. Not everyone who plays D&D is lucky enough to have groups that remain stable for long periods of time. I don't know what the exact average a group lasts is, but I'd bet it's somewhere around only one or two years. And that's not always a matter of having a bad DM. Groups have turnover for lots of reasons. One such example would be my experience being in the military. It meant I and everyone I gamed with would move every couple to a few years. As to the rest of your post, I see this as going nowhere good very fast. So I'm out. Enjoy the rest of the thread, and I'll see you around the forums. B-) [/QUOTE]

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