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Message: <blockquote data-quote="the Jester" data-source="post: 6085724" data-attributes="member: 1210">That's certainly possible. I never had trouble figuring out that stuff, but I handle math pretty well compared to many people, and since we never ever used a digital CB in my 3e experience, we never had a chance to check it.I can't speak to Pathfinder, as I haven't played it.This is probably true; I remember making epic level 3.5 bad guys and the math got really, really messy (attack values derived from base creature, advancement, class levels, size modifier, feats, ability bonuses... it's easy to miss stuff!). And God save me from trying to accurately figure out an advanced, epic-level wizard's skill points proper (tracking when his Int bonus was what, guessing on what magic items he had when, etc)... aargh.Then again, it was totally satisfying looking at my completed (f'rexample) half-dragon shadow human wizard 16/archmage 3/custom prestige class 4, and the act of creating it was extraordinarily enjoyable... even if it took hours and the npc/monster in question might die before he ever got to act.<img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> Likewise, making a high-level pc from scratch was fun but could take a ton of time if you wanted to research interesting options.Again, agreed on the easier dming- that is probably my favorite aspect of 4e (and I love a lot of things about 4e- just ran my game last night!).Yeah, a lot like those things. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /> But see, you highlight one of the things about 4e at the end there- until the relatively simple Essentials class builds, it was pretty hard to manage a single sheet of paper character sheet that told you everything that you needed to know in order to make good choices in combat. Those builds have done an amazing job of alleviating that particular weakness, but until they came out there weren't many good options for a player who wants that single sheet of paper instead of a bunch of pages and/or cards. Regardless, your point is a good one, and it's quite possible that the entire reason I never felt the same sense about 3e digital tools was that (other than the CD in the initial release of the PH) I never looked at any of them. Maybe all the characters in my 3e game had the same litter of errors as the 4e party; it's quite possible.</blockquote>

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