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Message: <blockquote data-quote="jgbrowning" data-source="post: 994108" data-attributes="member: 5724">You're encased by 45 pounds of metal? They've never seen you before? You've multiple weapons which show a lot of use? You have a non-local accent?  Magic can change things, that won't win you many friends in the populace. It's not unreasonable to believe that cities will have laws against people using magic while bargaining.They're not price gougers. They set a price they know you can afford.  There is no "set" price, no "right" price. Every transaction is unique and is influenced by who the buyer and seller are, perhaps even more than what is being sold. If the price is too high the buyer leaves, if the price is too low the seller won't sell. Now when you are encased in 45 pounds of metal, it's going to be very very very hard for you to get the same bargain that the seller's regular customers get.  Even if you try to go elsewhere.You have a DM. He'll have to decide if that's the case. This is an example where were you to get a system, the system would probably be ignored almost immediatly.  Your DM could up the purchase DCs to easily mimic this effect if he wants more realism.Pick up MMS:WE.  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />  Actually you're asking a question that seems simple, but is really impossibly complex. I'll talk more about the general stuff at the end of this post.  It may cost the NPC nothing, he simply uses his social standing to influence..  economics and social standing were basically the same thing for most of history and social "coin" is often more reliable.Again, your DM has to decide based upon circumstances, and again he can modifiy the DCs as he sees fit to simulate what he wants to happen.There is no "standard market value." There is no value beyond what one individual will pay and what one seller is willing to be paid. Items don't have a price. I view the prices listed in the books are guidelines, if the DM wants a more complex economy, or the prices are hard-and-fast if the DM isn't interested.What you do know when you use the DC system is how you can manipulate the overinflated tourist price systematically to produce the economic effects you want to simulate.Hell, you could throw out my idea of it being a "tourist" price and pretend it already is the "market price" or you could create all new prices that you consider the "market price" and then apply the DC system over that and it would perform admirably.Are you an NPC?  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin    :D"  data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" />  Players play PC so all gaming rules are designed upon PC interactions. The DM can easily ignore inconsistancies when dealing with NPC to NPC relationships.Generally, trying to mimic a real functioning medieval economy is futile. People today...1. Generally have no idea how hardly anything in the medieval period worked.2. Assume concepts developed much later to describe modern societies should hold true.3. We have quite a bit of data to make attempts at description, but that data is probably far from enough to make authoritative statements.4. Our modern view of economy is utterly dependant upon an ease of product movement and a belief in individual actions that are not teribbley accurate when discussing people outside of the environment in which our view of economy was formed.  (Example a villiage can be starving while 20 miles away one villiage has so much grain its having to fight off pests vigorously).Generally, buying things was a social interaction as opposed to it being a fiscal interaction that it has turned into today.Your posts make good points, but there is no way to answer them without basically saying, "This is good enough."  That point will vary with individuals. For example, do you want to include muliple coinages? Do you want to plot out areas in your kingdom that periodically experience specie shortages due fairs, ships coming it... etc?  Do you want to map out the routes of standard communication between smallish rural communities to plot the movement of mostly subsistance-level goods so you can indicate what viliages (and when) have higher level demands for certain products?The DC system is an attempt to simulate an economy in a game. If it's not to your level of liking, you'll have to find another method of determining economics.  It allows DMs to handway such complex issues as...1. Disparities in price due supply and demand.2. Disparities in price due inflation.3. Disparities in price due war.blah, blah, blah.... basically almost every issue that can possibly effect price can be simulated my altering the DC to make items more or less expensive.Which is the end result of all economic systems. Which things are more or less expensive and where. The why's involved are so complex and difficult to simulate that they are practically useless to try and explain.  At least from a PCs perspective.In fact, the point of the DC system is to not explain why, merely to simulate the effect allowing the DM to make up the reason why, because there are so may different ways thing can occur.joe b.</blockquote>

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