d20 mass combat

[nopantsyet]

my players seem to have generated interest in joining a war that happens to be going on. anybody know a good mass combat system? it doesn't have to be d20, but it should integrate well into dnd.

i was looking at the AEG war book, and like practically every d20 book on the market, it's mostly geared towards players with prestige classes, feats and spells. it has about 5 pages of actual mass combat rules, and they're really not detailed enough to make interesting use of in my campaign.

aaagh! why doesn't anybody make dm-oriented books other than modules and campaign settings!

 

[James McMurray]

Battlesystem for 1e (2e?) was fairly decent. There should ba a conversion on this site even.

 

[nopantsyet]

hmmm...that's a good idea...i'd forgotten about that. conversion library here is still closed. and the search on wotc sucks so i can't tell if they've got it esd. where's that angry face...here we go.

 

[Phoenix8008]

Well, the OD&D War Machine rules found in the Rules Cyclopedia or the Companion set rules could maybe be used. Personally, I'm waiting for the Eden Studios book: "Fields of Blood:The Book of War". It's supposed to come out this summer after a few delays since it's original release date of last fall. I can probably find a link for it somewhere...brb.

Ahh! Here it is!!

 

[Randolpho]

Ironic, I mentioned that in the "What you want for Dragonlance d20" thread.

D&D really needs a system of mass-combat rules. I always figured WotC would do one, too. Obviously, I was wrong.

 

[jasamcarl]

Well...

There is the Open Mass Combat System (OMCS) in the back of Mongoose's Quintessential Fighter. It is more than 5 pages (if that is even relevant), is an essentially abstract system which intigrates well enough into the d20 rules to allow reasonable extrapolation of a large number of specific effects from spells, feats, skills, pc actions in general, etc. The QF is also blessed with advanced rules on stronghold construction, siege engines, a list of prices for mercenaries, rules for their recruitment, and tournements...

 

[Umbran]

The best way I've seen to do mass combat in D&D is to... not do mass combat.

The best war mechanic I've seen was rather nice - the DM sets up a number of battlefield encounters - all combats on the "normal" scale, smaller sections of the full battle. The DM decides how the battle would go without the PC's intervention, and how the results of these conflicts will change the battle as a whole. The players get the chance ot change the outcome of a battle without ever having to resort to full mass combat rules.

 

[Avantgeek]

Suggestion

I can't think of any 3e systems that you can use, but I have a suggestion (on the simple side, mind you, but easily workable)...

Set up one battle (and/or skirmish area) to have the PCs involved in, figure out what ratio of the PCs to the total forces in their army is (either number or hit points); run that one battle, and apply the PCs loses to their side based on the ratio.

Dunno if that helps any.

 

[James McMurray]

Nopantsyet: Yeah, WotC's got it as an ESD. Also, if you want to email me, I can ship you a copy of the conversion. Of course, the conversion is completely worthless without the original, but it does has an army roster sheet that can give you a good idea of what to expect. The thing I liked about Battlesystem was the fact that most spells are already covered in it, and there are some guidelines for adding more.

It also has the plus of coming in three sections: basic, standard, and advanced I think. Your group can learn them incrementally before actually going into an in-gae war. Or you can do what I plan on doing and have the war be several battles long, with the first a minor one using basic rules, the second a bigger one with normal, and the rest of the battles using the full rules.

After my group finishes going through Return tot he Tomb of Horrors, they're moving into Bloodstone Pass as the new lords of the area. There'll be battles galore waiting for them.