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Message: <blockquote data-quote="takyris" data-source="post: 2075320" data-attributes="member: 5171">Hey Shaman,Lots of interesting thoughts.  Good analysis, and thanks for posting it.I'm not sure I agree with you here.  I think I'd be better able to form an opinion if I knew what kind of talents you'd like to see.  The Charismatic Hero's talents, as far as I can tell, work equally well in just about any setting.  The Smart Hero initially bugged me in d20 Modern because I wanted to see a Hacking talent tree, but by keeping the Smart Hero's talents time-period indistinct, they've made the talents equally useful in any time period.  Same with Tough and Dedicated and, well, all of 'em, near as I can tell.  The Talents seem specifically designed to be completely generic -- in a good way.Right now, if I pick up a book with a new time period, I'll have to ask my GM whether feats relating to sailing or spaceship operations or knot tying or cybernetics are allowable, but I'll never have to ask about talents (at least from the core books -- I know that there are additional Talent Trees out on the market).  While it's possible to disagree with any design choice (and I'm assuming that we're in agreement that their refusal to make new Talent Trees implies that they think that the existing trees are usable in any time period), I'm not sure why you believe that "make new feats, not new skills or talent trees" makes Basic Classes weaker. I'm not saying you're wrong -- I just don't know why you believe that, and I'd like to hear your reasoning.Not sure where to go on this one.  On one hand, I don't agree with you, but in all honesty, that's probably because I modify AdC's for my campaigns, and I'm effectively making new ones myself, so it's hypocritical disagreement at best. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />  I would take away the Personal Firearms Proficiency from the Solider AdC, pop in Archaic Weapons Proficiency, change a couple of the bonus feats, and say "Ta-dah!  Your Master Swordsman is complete!"Honestly, my request for WotC is far more specialized, so specialized that I'm really fine with doing it myself.  I like non-FX or light-FX campaigns, and I like to have special abilities that are essentially expanded uses of skills.  Getting "Charm Animal" from a druid-like advanced class wouldn't impress me, but getting an ability that let me use my Handle Animals skill as Diplomacy to modify the mood of wild animals is a nice light-FX ability that I'd love to have in a campaign.  (I believe this exists, possibly in Urban Arcana?  No books with me right now.)  Rather than getting the ability to turn invisible, I'd like the ability to hide in plain sight in a specific type of terrain (woodland, desert, etc) for a ranger-like scouting AdC.  That expands the use of my skills, rather than tacking on an entire new ability -- and since I believe that skills are the core power of d20 Modern (with most talents and feats giving bonuses to their use), that makes me happy.Sorry, thread-drift over. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />No issues with your historical veracity.  I guess my question is what your "swashbuckling privateer" AdC would get that makes it different from, for example, a Fast/Tough/Daredevil?  Fast gives you Tumble and Pilot, Tough gives you Climb (and Concentration for Daredevil), and Daredevil gives you the swashbucklery you need to leap from one ship to another.If you can make a Captain (Smart with Savant:Navigate and Plan to help organize attacks on other ships), a ship-builder and repairman (Strong with Repair and Craft(Structural)), a surefooted man in the crow's nest (Tough with Climb and Spot), a world-class helmsman and catapult-manner (Fast with Pilot and Craft(Mechanical), a grizzled ship's doctor who can sense trouble in the air (Dedicated with Treat Injury and Intuition from the Empathy tree), or a bellowing sergeant who gets the lads to their tasks through thick or thin (Charismatic with the Coordinate Talent)... what's missing?  I'm not saying that there's no room for an Advanced Class -- heck, there's always room for something in a specific campaign, and if they'd had more than 96 pages, I'd certainly not mind seeing a Sailor advanced class, if only to give me an idea of what a good profession-specific class might look like -- but I think that you can do it without those classes and still have a good time.  I didn't even go into Occupations with those examples above, and I didn't multiclass, which I'd almost certainly do.Or possibly you've already answered my point. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Since I wasn't behind any closed doors, my guess would be that the conversation probably went something like "Well, we looked at a bunch of groups, looked at a lot of gamers and their interests, and we realized that the average gamer is just fine with having lots of non-combat skills, but is unlikely to take an entire Advanced Class that doesn't help him in combat or at least in confrontations.  To that end, we're making most of our AdC options combat-useful.  Can you come up with a Sailor-type AdC that is good enough that somebody would take it instead of taking any three of Strong, Tough, Fast, and Soldier to get someone with all the same skills and more combat power?  No?  Well, we're gonna go with the musketeer, then."I'm not saying that campaigns don't exist where an AdC involving bonuses on Repair or Craft checks, bonuses to Balance checks to stay upright in stormy weather, and (at high level) the ability to predict the weather or steer a ship through treacherous reefs while blinded by lightning would be cool and useful.  I just suspect that, as Vigilance said about their non-FX classes, WotC considers that a niche market.  Right now, they figure that anyone in an ordinary campaign who wants those abilities will take a good occupation and then put ranks in Repair, Craft, Balance, Pilot, and Navigate, along with something like Faith or Intuition for those "Got a feelin' deep in me bones about the water off to starboard..." situations.No clue, but I share your wish that the AdCs they make ARE ones that can apply across a wide range.  Or at least, ones that can be modified to fit my campaign.Excellent point, too.  Did anybody see a poll at Wizards asking about AdC use?  Maybe after d20 Future they did some market research and saw that most of their AdCs weren't being used.  Or maybe they figured that they'd be able to sneak more AdCs in through web enhancements.  Or maybe they ran out of space and got frustrated with their bosses, who were forcing them to stick to 96 pages, and stayed up late trying to figure out what they could cut in order to get down to the right size and ended up grudgingly settling for some of the AdCs.  Could be any or all of the above.  But you are right, regardless, that it's a bummer that more weren't included.Well, while I share your pain, I do have to admit that FX AdCs are easier to make shiny and spiffy.  That's the state of the industry -- at least as far as WotC's research is concerned.  It ain't my game, but my game ain't common -- and most of us on ENWorld can probably say the same. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>

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