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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Longshadow" data-source="post: 1770609" data-attributes="member: 19626">Sigh.(1) Distinctly limited perspective, as I've seen exactly the same breed of twinkies thrive using both rules sets, and(2) Really not helping advance your case any -- anything that feels like it must be prefaced with "not to sound elitist" almost invariably comes off sounding very elitist. <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/paranoid.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":uhoh:" title="Paranoid    :uhoh:" data-shortname=":uhoh:" /> Back to the thread, and making sure that everybody remembers that the thread starter was asking for personal opinions and not "When Jesus was leaving our last game he showed me a picture of the rock outside Heaven where his dad carved into stone my proclamations about gaming" announcements and dismissals from on high, I will wade in and say that no, I don't think the setting translates well to either d20 or GURPS, nor are such conversions called for (I'm hard pressed to think of a single such translation for any non-d20 originating game that I've actually liked).  It does function well in the system designed specifically for it and evolved over 15 years and three editions.  GURPS, IMO, only handles well a very limited, mundane, and not-at-all-cinematic game.  D20, IMO, only handles well and over the top video-game-on-paper feel at best or a wargamer-only-crunchy-crunch-need-apply heavy-handed balance and accounting fixation at worst (boy, is that gonna attract flames no matter how else I could have phrased it).  I won't delve too much into GURPS specifics (I avoid GURPS, playing or running, and only have some of the books for source mateial -- which the line is always good for <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" /> ).  But on d20:--Combat--Doesn't remain cinematically gritty enough.  Too hard to actually kill characters, especially one-shot kills.  SR is lethal. LETHAL.  Only munchkin wet-dreams that no GM should let be played waltz through without a care.  Even with MDT in play, d20 doesn't have this.  A 10th level Tough Hero could take a maxed out crit from a 50 caliber rifle and not go down, not act with any penalty, not even necessarily slow down until the magic 0 HP roll around (after sucking up an absolute barrage of gunfire to force it) and then suddenly drop over.  Boom.   <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f641.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":(" title="Frown    :("  data-smilie="3"data-shortname=":(" /> In fact, any game where a character can hold a grenade in his hands, watch it explode and say "Ouch.  I really shouldn't do that." before wiping his hands clean and walking off isn't a good fit for a dark, cyberpunkish future -- IN MY OPINION.--Magic--Even with the logic tweaks d20 added to the old D&D magic system, it still shows it's Vancian roots.  In the SR setting, a powerful enough will in a mage allows him to cast spell after spell over and over (though spell selection is considerably more limited).  When he finally gimps out, he's gonna collapse, not just pull out a weapon, apologize to his friends for running out of spells, and begin blasting away without penalty.  Several new subsystem add-ons would be required in the d20 magic system to emulate that.--All or Nothing Skills--d20 is set up for skill success or skill failure, not gradation of success.  This would be the easiest thing to fix of the difficulties encountered (and Unearthed Arcana's introduction of complex skill checks starts you on the path), but still reflects the grit in the worldview.Personally, I think settings designed with d20 in mind from conception are the only ones that really work in d20.  I loathed the Deadland and Fading Sun ports, and really, really, really hated the Aberrant port.  Does that make d20 a bad game?  No.  It just means it isn't perfect for all things; but then, regardless of the fanatic devotion of HERO, GURPS, or d20 system acolytes, no system is perfect for all things. :\ Oh, well.  There's my .02 on the matter.  I'll sit back and wait for the attacks to now begin. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f60e.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":cool:" title="Cool    :cool:"  data-smilie="6"data-shortname=":cool:" /></blockquote>

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