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Message: <blockquote data-quote="77IM" data-source="post: 5945870" data-attributes="member: 12377">Yeah. I tried gauge that too, though, rating "other benefits" as being worth 1-3 d6's or so, but it's a very rough guess.It's not a codification! Dear Gygax, that's the last thing I want! I'm trying to make a guideline which is a starting point to help the GM figure it out based on the specific circumstances.Pop quiz: When a PC pushes a heavy weapons rack so it falls down onto some goblins, how much damage should that do? 1d4-1? 2d6? 6d2? 10d37+9.5? 1d12+1d8/3? For me, having a simple guideline as a reference point makes it a lot easier to come up with an answer.But I wouldn't want anything "codified," because that implies a sort of strictness that is very unhelpful.If you use a contest of ability checks to resolve the maneuver, than it does: the fighter will be much more likely to succeed on a Strength-based maneuver than a wizard would. Furthermore, the fighter has a higher load limit than the wizard so for tricks based on heavy objects the fighter can move heavier objects and possibly do more damage. Similarly, when the battle is in an alchemist's lab, and a PC wants to grab some chemicals to splash in a duergar's face, the high-Int wizard will have a better chance of finding the right stuff.Well we won't know how damage scales until we see higher level characters (and Mearls has said that they might rework all the damage numbers anyway).But, I don't think the maneuvers should scale up "for free" for reasons you mention. Pushing a boulder onto a goblin for 2d6 damage might be a good move. Pushing that same boulder onto a red dragon... should STILL do 2d6 damage and probably won't bother the dragon at all.At higher levels, though, the PCs might be fighting in more dangerous environs or have more lethal resources at their disposal. For example, when a 12th-level party is fighting demons at the top of a wizard's tower and they manage to maneuver the balor in between the two lightning orbs? He should get zapped for way more than 2d6 damage. Maybe 12d6.It occurs to me that traps should probably have a damage-by-level guideline at some point and that using the same numbers for PC maneuvers would be a great idea. -- 77IM</blockquote>

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