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Damage on a Miss: Because otherwise Armour Class makes no sense
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<blockquote data-quote="tomBitonti" data-source="post: 6271814" data-attributes="member: 13107"><p>A melee attack can easily be subject to concealment or cover. An attacker might attack an opponent, say, who is behind a low wall, or a latticework.</p><p></p><p>A melee attack which missed might very well go unnoticed. Of course, if damage is applied in the absence of an obvious source, the player will notice. I see that as a weakness of DOAM, hence, the "the player feels a sudden chill, as if someone just walked on their grave" statement, where a player loses hit points in the absence of an obvious source.</p><p></p><p>DOAM represents an opportunity cost of adding extra damage in a normal fashion (<em>Weapon Specialization</em>), but applied differently. Actually, when modeled as a feat (see below), the similarity with Weapon Specialization is striking.</p><p></p><p>---</p><p></p><p>Let's create a 3E weapon ability which is about the same as DOAM.</p><p></p><p><em>Implacable</em>: Melee weapons only. When used to make a melee attack, this weapon does damage even on a miss. On a miss, the weapon does its enchantment bonus plus the wielder's strength damage bonus for the weapon.</p><p></p><p>Damage is not applied if the defender has concealment. Secondary effects, such as poison or sneak attack, are not applied as a part of implacable damage. DR is applied to implacable damage.</p><p></p><p>A feat seems to be fitting, too:</p><p></p><p>Feat: Implacable Weapon</p><p>Prerequisite: Weapon Focus, Fighter Level 5</p><p></p><p>Effect: When selecting this feat, select a melee weapon type which the fighter has previously selected for Weapon Focus. A melee weapon of the selected type is considered to have the <em>Implacable</em> weapon quality while wielded by the fighter.</p><p></p><p>Lots of room for adjustment to the prerequisites.</p><p></p><p>---</p><p></p><p>I'm still bothered by odd scaling: As a player ability, this would provide an incentive to fight defensively and simply wear down an opponent. I don't think we want to slow down combat.</p><p></p><p>At higher levels, the small amount of damage seems to make this a weak player option.</p><p></p><p>I can see an option like this for handling many weak enemies, but then, I don't need an explicit option: As a simplification, I'd just have the weak enemy do a fixed amount of damage. But, if they are weak, should they do damage on a miss? As an option for weak opponents, the whole "on a miss part" doesn't seem to be the core of what is wanted, which is a simplified way of applying damage.</p><p></p><p>For cases where a player is willing to trade damage for a bonus to hit, an inverted <em>Power Attack</em> type feat seems to work better.</p><p></p><p>Thx!</p><p></p><p>TomB</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="tomBitonti, post: 6271814, member: 13107"] A melee attack can easily be subject to concealment or cover. An attacker might attack an opponent, say, who is behind a low wall, or a latticework. A melee attack which missed might very well go unnoticed. Of course, if damage is applied in the absence of an obvious source, the player will notice. I see that as a weakness of DOAM, hence, the "the player feels a sudden chill, as if someone just walked on their grave" statement, where a player loses hit points in the absence of an obvious source. DOAM represents an opportunity cost of adding extra damage in a normal fashion ([i]Weapon Specialization[/i]), but applied differently. Actually, when modeled as a feat (see below), the similarity with Weapon Specialization is striking. --- Let's create a 3E weapon ability which is about the same as DOAM. [i]Implacable[/i]: Melee weapons only. When used to make a melee attack, this weapon does damage even on a miss. On a miss, the weapon does its enchantment bonus plus the wielder's strength damage bonus for the weapon. Damage is not applied if the defender has concealment. Secondary effects, such as poison or sneak attack, are not applied as a part of implacable damage. DR is applied to implacable damage. A feat seems to be fitting, too: Feat: Implacable Weapon Prerequisite: Weapon Focus, Fighter Level 5 Effect: When selecting this feat, select a melee weapon type which the fighter has previously selected for Weapon Focus. A melee weapon of the selected type is considered to have the [i]Implacable[/i] weapon quality while wielded by the fighter. Lots of room for adjustment to the prerequisites. --- I'm still bothered by odd scaling: As a player ability, this would provide an incentive to fight defensively and simply wear down an opponent. I don't think we want to slow down combat. At higher levels, the small amount of damage seems to make this a weak player option. I can see an option like this for handling many weak enemies, but then, I don't need an explicit option: As a simplification, I'd just have the weak enemy do a fixed amount of damage. But, if they are weak, should they do damage on a miss? As an option for weak opponents, the whole "on a miss part" doesn't seem to be the core of what is wanted, which is a simplified way of applying damage. For cases where a player is willing to trade damage for a bonus to hit, an inverted [i]Power Attack[/i] type feat seems to work better. Thx! TomB [/QUOTE]
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