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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Erratic K" data-source="post: 1273726" data-attributes="member: 14360">Neither...it isn't that I dislike them.  They both have their merits.  But to better fit my game:I houseruled up my own.I also did a racial levels conversion of the Athas races.  My players don't like anything with ECL.  I hope the soon to be released rules by Dave Noonan do the use racial levels and don't use the defiler as in Dragon.  He is supposed to be doing Dark Sun in Dungeon/Dragon magazines according to the recent issue.The Athas.org version has two major drawbacks for me:1) I think is not enough like the base classes in 3E in terms of core mechanics. Players have to learn a bunch to get going.2) it isn't power compatible (it is strictly better than other classes the Bard on Athas has a problem like that too).But both of those play to it's strength- which is it more faithfully reproduces the feel of the 2E class.The Dragon Magazine class has two major drawbacks:1) It departs too far from the feel of the old 2E class (defiling optional? What?)2) Even though it is 3E mostly, I hate busy work for little return and tracking defiler points is fiddly and has little return for me as a GM.  It is something I'd have to enforce on my players (and it has negative impact on the players).  I'd never track it for NPC's- it is just extra work.-E</blockquote>