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<blockquote data-quote="nevin" data-source="post: 9553637" data-attributes="member: 7024481">honestly it's one of those things that is exacerbated by the fact that there are no real restrictions on the magic system as a whole.&nbsp;&nbsp; If you had to invoke the gods of darkness and open yourself up to them to use a darkness based spell, this argument would mostly go away.&nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; The entire magic system needs to be reworked with some magic being normal and easy enough to do and some magic requiring deals and costs that not everyone is going to be willing to do.&nbsp; That and stuff like if you are casting magic in a magical creatures domain they may notice, The local fairy Queen might come interfere, the dragon may get mad or if he thinks you are too dangerous just leave.&nbsp;&nbsp; Magic got pigenholed as the &quot;get passed the DM's Hijinx&quot; card and now DM's have to think past all the magic made to get passed all the Hijinx of 50 decades of players.&nbsp;&nbsp; I'm not saying you can't run a game with magic in it's current state but It does get painful and diffucult to make encounters at higher level because of it.&nbsp; &nbsp; Some of the monster abilities that turned into racials and feats like Darkvision are just part of that whole problem.&nbsp; &nbsp; I dont' want magic to become generic firebolts and silvery barbs but I do want magic at higher levels to require deals and invoking dangerous unreliable forces.&nbsp;&nbsp; I want the magic user to look at the part and say &quot;no lets go around moria&quot; , not sure I've got 50 spells to deal with balrogs.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="nevin, post: 9553637, member: 7024481"] honestly it's one of those things that is exacerbated by the fact that there are no real restrictions on the magic system as a whole. If you had to invoke the gods of darkness and open yourself up to them to use a darkness based spell, this argument would mostly go away. The entire magic system needs to be reworked with some magic being normal and easy enough to do and some magic requiring deals and costs that not everyone is going to be willing to do. That and stuff like if you are casting magic in a magical creatures domain they may notice, The local fairy Queen might come interfere, the dragon may get mad or if he thinks you are too dangerous just leave. Magic got pigenholed as the "get passed the DM's Hijinx" card and now DM's have to think past all the magic made to get passed all the Hijinx of 50 decades of players. I'm not saying you can't run a game with magic in it's current state but It does get painful and diffucult to make encounters at higher level because of it. Some of the monster abilities that turned into racials and feats like Darkvision are just part of that whole problem. I dont' want magic to become generic firebolts and silvery barbs but I do want magic at higher levels to require deals and invoking dangerous unreliable forces. I want the magic user to look at the part and say "no lets go around moria" , not sure I've got 50 spells to deal with balrogs. [/QUOTE]

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