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<blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 3807361" data-attributes="member: 2525">Not going to spoon feed it to you if you accuse me of not citing my source, which I have done multiple times at this point (and you well know it, because you repeat it below).Can spot be used to see someone not hiding, or not? That's the question I am posing to you.&nbsp; You can dodge the question, or not.&nbsp; Right now you seem to be dodging.Well then you and I are reading the same sentences and coming to a different conclusion.&nbsp; The spot skill says it can be used to see things that are not hiding but are still difficult to spot.&nbsp; To me, that would include distant things (which would be hard to see, but which are not hiding).&nbsp; It also gives spot modifiers for seeing things at a distance, without mentioning hiding, which again implies to me that it is used to see distant things that are not hiding.&nbsp; The DMG then says you use spot, listen and sight ranges to determine when an encounter begins, without any mention of hiding, which again implies spot can be used to see distant things that are not hiding.&nbsp; All of that to me says you can use spot to see distant things that are not hiding.&nbsp; If you don't read it that way, I'm not sure what else I can do to help you out.&nbsp; Can you at least admit that it is one reasonable interpretation of those three rules I just cited that you can use spot to see things at a distance which are not hiding, or are you still convinced that your interpretation is the only possible reasonable one?It's in the spot skill. I've said that before, given examples, and spelled it out.&nbsp; You're going in circles.There is some logic to that stances, but it's not irrefutable, and it's been refuted.&nbsp; We have two competing reasonable interpretations of how it would work.&nbsp; Your continuing repetition of your position and assertion that anyone who disagrees with your conclusion cannot possibly be right is less than compelling.&nbsp;&nbsp; I understand that yo think you have it right.&nbsp; I don't understand that you think you MUST be right and that there is no chance at all that you are wrong.&nbsp; It's an unhelpful attitude at best.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Mistwell, post: 3807361, member: 2525"] Not going to spoon feed it to you if you accuse me of not citing my source, which I have done multiple times at this point (and you well know it, because you repeat it below). Can spot be used to see someone not hiding, or not? That's the question I am posing to you. You can dodge the question, or not. Right now you seem to be dodging. Well then you and I are reading the same sentences and coming to a different conclusion. The spot skill says it can be used to see things that are not hiding but are still difficult to spot. To me, that would include distant things (which would be hard to see, but which are not hiding). It also gives spot modifiers for seeing things at a distance, without mentioning hiding, which again implies to me that it is used to see distant things that are not hiding. The DMG then says you use spot, listen and sight ranges to determine when an encounter begins, without any mention of hiding, which again implies spot can be used to see distant things that are not hiding. All of that to me says you can use spot to see distant things that are not hiding. If you don't read it that way, I'm not sure what else I can do to help you out. Can you at least admit that it is one reasonable interpretation of those three rules I just cited that you can use spot to see things at a distance which are not hiding, or are you still convinced that your interpretation is the only possible reasonable one? It's in the spot skill. I've said that before, given examples, and spelled it out. You're going in circles. There is some logic to that stances, but it's not irrefutable, and it's been refuted. We have two competing reasonable interpretations of how it would work. Your continuing repetition of your position and assertion that anyone who disagrees with your conclusion cannot possibly be right is less than compelling. I understand that yo think you have it right. I don't understand that you think you MUST be right and that there is no chance at all that you are wrong. It's an unhelpful attitude at best. [/QUOTE]

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