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<blockquote data-quote="Jhulae" data-source="post: 3823642" data-attributes="member: 16958">For that specific example, DC 16 with a -5 to the roll for distance instead of -10.&nbsp; (In essence, DC 21 instead of DC 26.)&nbsp; As I said, it was a 'meh' explanation, especially given the fact the thread dealt with medium sized stuff (no size modifier) up to that point.&nbsp; Of course, now looking over the tables, having the creature 'doubled in size' would be spot DC 18 (including all penalties).&nbsp; It's just much easier, to me, to use -1 for every 20' instead of 10'.Under your system, if the PCs were traveling from one city to another, and were, for instance, coming down a mountain trail, they wouldn't be able to see an enemy encampment bracing up for a battle a mile to the West (no matter how big it was) on their way to the city on the East.&nbsp; So, it certainly does matter.&nbsp; And, even saying that the DM describes it on their way to the city still doesn't change the fact that later on, when they go back to assault said camp, they are unable to see it again until they approach within 200' or so (since now they're 'encountering' the camp) is absolutely ludicrous in my mind.Okay.&nbsp; Now this is where the crux of the difference lies.&nbsp; Even taking your interpretation for maximum vision distance and spot skill into account, the rules specifically state that Darkvision has an inviolate range per species, while it does *not* say that about any kind of 'normal' vision.&nbsp; To me (and others), when the rules say Darkvision Range X', that X isn't changed by anything (except maybe magic, but a spyglass definitely isn't magic).</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jhulae, post: 3823642, member: 16958"] For that specific example, DC 16 with a -5 to the roll for distance instead of -10. (In essence, DC 21 instead of DC 26.) As I said, it was a 'meh' explanation, especially given the fact the thread dealt with medium sized stuff (no size modifier) up to that point. Of course, now looking over the tables, having the creature 'doubled in size' would be spot DC 18 (including all penalties). It's just much easier, to me, to use -1 for every 20' instead of 10'. Under your system, if the PCs were traveling from one city to another, and were, for instance, coming down a mountain trail, they wouldn't be able to see an enemy encampment bracing up for a battle a mile to the West (no matter how big it was) on their way to the city on the East. So, it certainly does matter. And, even saying that the DM describes it on their way to the city still doesn't change the fact that later on, when they go back to assault said camp, they are unable to see it again until they approach within 200' or so (since now they're 'encountering' the camp) is absolutely ludicrous in my mind. Okay. Now this is where the crux of the difference lies. Even taking your interpretation for maximum vision distance and spot skill into account, the rules specifically state that Darkvision has an inviolate range per species, while it does *not* say that about any kind of 'normal' vision. To me (and others), when the rules say Darkvision Range X', that X isn't changed by anything (except maybe magic, but a spyglass definitely isn't magic). [/QUOTE]

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