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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Grompi" data-source="post: 1239869" data-attributes="member: 15403">Thanks very much for your support, but Brother Shatterstone apologized for his assumptions. That's good enough for me.I wonder two things, though. One is why you latched onto only the negative things I said, without even acknowledging the good things. The other is if you read all of my posts, because you certainly didn't respond to everything or any of my acknowledgements of fault. Other people didn't take time to respond to things asked of them either. Is that how discussion works? For example, and I know its not your job to let me know, but I still don't know what "spam an attack" and "troll" mean.Am I uninformed if I haven't read the whole book, or does having already read the document you refer to count? (I've cited having read this document already.)My take:With the assumption that the racial talents and transformations come as part of advancing in another class (a point made earlier and not refuted), and the purpose of Dawnforge is a young world with Gilgamesh types roaming around (epic types, even at lower levels), then it works. It's especially cool, because my minotaur may well be different than others, even though the usual development seems to be predictable. Level 1: Gore, Level 2: Scent, Level 3: Powerful Charge, Level 4: Natural Armor, Level 5: Second Wind, Level 6: Large, and so on.Does Large size grant the usual changes in ability scores? Interestingly enough, an 8th-level minotaur is significantly stronger than the one in the MM 9ECL 8), even if the size change offers no ability score changes. That's cool. Lets see:Character using the minotaur rules (assuming size change doesn't increase ability scores):Lambi, male minotaur Ftr8: CR 8; Large monstrous humanoid (8 ft., 9 in. tall); HD 8d10+40; hp 81; Init +0; Spd 30 ft.; AC 21 (+8 armor, +3 shield, +1 natural, -1 size), touch 10, flat-footed 22; Base Atk +8; Grap +17; Attack +14 melee (1d12+10/19-20 x3 +1 greataxe), or +8 ranged (1d8+4/x3 composite longbow); Full Atk +14/+9 melee (1d12+10/19-20 x3 +1 greataxe) and +8 (1d8+2 gore), or +8/+3 (1d8+4/x3 composite longbow); SV Fort +11, Ref +4, Will +3; AL CN; Str 20 (+5), Dex 10, Con 20 (+5), Int 10, Wis 13 (+1), Cha 6 (-2).Languages: Common, GiantSkills and Feats: Climb +2*, Jump +2*, Intimidate +3, Listen +2, Ride +5, Spot +3, Swim +5*; Blind Fight, Cleave, Improved Critical (greataxe), Improved Unarmed Strike, Lightning Reflexes, Power Attack, Weapon Focus (great axe), Weapon Focus (gore), Weapon Specialization (great axe). (*Includes armor check penalty of –8, Swim includes weight of gear and ring.)Racial Talents: Gore, Powerful Charge, Second Wind, Talent Feat (Weapon Focus).Racial Traits: Low-light Vision, Natural Cunning.Racial Transformations: Large, Monstrous Humanoid, Natural Armor (+1), Scent.Possessions: +1 half-plate, +1 large steel shield, throwing axes (4, masterwork), composite longbow (masterwork, mighty +4), quiver (14 arrows), ring of swimming (improved), potion of cure serious wounds (3), hew's handy haversack, 433 gp.(I give permission to reuse Lambi's stats in any way that's legal within the OGL and FFG's claims to Product Identity.)Shouldn't gore add the full Str bonus when it's the only attack used in a round?The only thing I don't think works are the start at Medium size with Large size coming as a racial transformation associated with level and not age (or magical influence)—unless that's in the book and not this document. I had a problem with the giant's transformation to Large in Arcana Unearthed, until I found out the transformation is based on a magical ceremony. On another note, also a problem in my opinion about Arcana Unearthed, and a problem with the minotaur is why PC races with natural weapons don't already know how to use those weapons as part of a racial package, especially if their culture is militaristic (favors the fighter class).With the minotaurs in this document, I wondered why "Natural Cunning: A minotaur can never be lost, is never flat-footed, and is immune to maze spells." wasn't made into a talent (never needs Survival checks to avoid being lost [granting that allowing a party to get lost is rarely a good story element], never suffers one of the most troublesome things about being caught in combat, and is immune to an 8th-level spell) and monstrous humanoid and darkvision just made part of the race. Monstrous humanoid makes the minotaur immune to some minor spells (like charm person), but that's about it. The development of this trait and darkvision later in life just seems kind of weird (without magical intervention). The development of natural cunning later in life doesn't seem weird.I realize you were probably trying to avoid the infamous level adjustment, but why? A full-fledged minotaur is only LA +2. A watered down version that needs training in, say, the charge, has only 1 or two HD, and no natural cunning could easily be ECL 1 (or 2 with 2 HD), altered (of course) by your powerful character premise in the Dawnforge setting. That's my two coppers, anyhow. Interesting concepts.EDIT: Lambi's size penalty/bonus to grapple. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f631.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":o" title="Eek!    :o"  data-smilie="9"data-shortname=":o" /></blockquote>

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