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<blockquote data-quote="N'raac" data-source="post: 6015326" data-attributes="member: 6681948">Someone mentioned negative energy levels.&nbsp; Drowning/suffocation is pretty effective if you can stall out the rounds it will take before the saves kick in.&nbsp; Ability damage is also highly effective.&nbsp;Why?&nbsp; All three bypass hit points, so they remain highly effective at higher levels.&nbsp; A 15th level fighter isn't too worried about three attacks doing 4d8 + 12.&nbsp; Some will miss, he has lots of hp and the cleric will fix that right up again.&nbsp; His 14 CON and 15th level means he has 117 hp (on average) so he's pretty secure.&nbsp;How about three attacks doing 1d6 CON damage?&nbsp; That's scary.&nbsp; The Cleric can't cure it spontaneously.&nbsp; He's only got 14 CON, so he sees that resource dwindling fast.&nbsp; Make it STR damage - he has limited STR, every hit downgrades his chances to hit and his damage, and once he's at 0 STR, he's pretty easy to kill, however high his hp might be.&nbsp; INT, WIS or CHA damage?&nbsp; Bet one of those stats got dumped...&nbsp;And let's not forget that any feats with stat-related prerequ's can't be used if he no longer has the prereq.&nbsp; STR's down to 12?&nbsp; No more Power Attack.&nbsp; DEX falls from 19 to 14?&nbsp; Greater, Improved and base Two Weapon Fighting are gone.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="N'raac, post: 6015326, member: 6681948"] Someone mentioned negative energy levels. Drowning/suffocation is pretty effective if you can stall out the rounds it will take before the saves kick in. Ability damage is also highly effective. Why? All three bypass hit points, so they remain highly effective at higher levels. A 15th level fighter isn't too worried about three attacks doing 4d8 + 12. Some will miss, he has lots of hp and the cleric will fix that right up again. His 14 CON and 15th level means he has 117 hp (on average) so he's pretty secure. How about three attacks doing 1d6 CON damage? That's scary. The Cleric can't cure it spontaneously. He's only got 14 CON, so he sees that resource dwindling fast. Make it STR damage - he has limited STR, every hit downgrades his chances to hit and his damage, and once he's at 0 STR, he's pretty easy to kill, however high his hp might be. INT, WIS or CHA damage? Bet one of those stats got dumped... And let's not forget that any feats with stat-related prerequ's can't be used if he no longer has the prereq. STR's down to 12? No more Power Attack. DEX falls from 19 to 14? Greater, Improved and base Two Weapon Fighting are gone. [/QUOTE]

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