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<blockquote data-quote="Manbearcat" data-source="post: 6642653" data-attributes="member: 6696971">This point and the prior post it stemmed from are pretty insightful when it comes to the often awkward, often vacillating, social dynamics of hobbies specifically or leisure activities generally.&nbsp; Different people are looking for varying, sometimes significantly so, returns on the investment of their time, energy and emotion.&nbsp; For example:I have two weekly games of basketball that I attend.&nbsp; Game 1 - This is a hyper competitive game that includes 20-somethings and 30-somethings who are all alphas and life-long athletes.&nbsp; It is very high quality ball.&nbsp; However, this game is overfilled with a bunch of jerks that I would have absolutely ZERO association with outside of this game.&nbsp; There are only two guys out of this group that I like as a human being and only one of those two I would call friend.&nbsp; Most are hyper-narcissists and average to bad sportsmen.&nbsp; Stray physical and verbal altercations are to be expected, but the whole thing holds together nonetheless.&nbsp; It sates the primal need to compete as hard as possible and the emotional quantity that comes only from the tribal camaraderie that spins out of a shared objective in intense physical conflict.&nbsp; Game 2 - This is a game of guys in their late 30s and several in their 40s and 50s.&nbsp; I have been playing with these guys for 25 years...literally when I was 13 and several of them were mid to late 20s.&nbsp; These guys are all very good athletes for their ages, but they're all well out of their prime and some are playing on fumes after a life of injuries.&nbsp; While the game is very fun and competitive enough, it is tantamount to a &quot;beer and pretzels&quot; RPG game.&nbsp; I have to throttle back a few gears to keep things fun for everyone as I'm the youngest out there and still athletic enough that I can play with 20 year olds.&nbsp; But I love every one of these guys.&nbsp; Good men.&nbsp; Good fathers.&nbsp; Great sportsmen.&nbsp; Great pals.&nbsp; And like I said, still good athletes, especially for their ages.&nbsp; It sates the natural need for community with kindred spirits and people that I very much enjoy being around and have a long, shared history with.&nbsp; It also sates the need to escape mentally from the world and lose myself in the breezy, zen moments inherent to doing competition-lite, physical stuff.Neither experience supplants the other.&nbsp; They're diverse experiences and the crowd and ritual aspects are intrinsic to that diversity.&nbsp; Bringing it back to MO, his RPG and social needs, and how this group placates them, are likely more complex than he even realizes.&nbsp; He may even revel in some of this conflict and competition between he and &quot;Tantrum Guy&quot; and he doesn't even know it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Manbearcat, post: 6642653, member: 6696971"] This point and the prior post it stemmed from are pretty insightful when it comes to the often awkward, often vacillating, social dynamics of hobbies specifically or leisure activities generally. Different people are looking for varying, sometimes significantly so, returns on the investment of their time, energy and emotion. For example: I have two weekly games of basketball that I attend. Game 1 - This is a hyper competitive game that includes 20-somethings and 30-somethings who are all alphas and life-long athletes. It is very high quality ball. However, this game is overfilled with a bunch of jerks that I would have absolutely ZERO association with outside of this game. There are only two guys out of this group that I like as a human being and only one of those two I would call friend. Most are hyper-narcissists and average to bad sportsmen. Stray physical and verbal altercations are to be expected, but the whole thing holds together nonetheless. It sates the primal need to compete as hard as possible and the emotional quantity that comes only from the tribal camaraderie that spins out of a shared objective in intense physical conflict. Game 2 - This is a game of guys in their late 30s and several in their 40s and 50s. I have been playing with these guys for 25 years...literally when I was 13 and several of them were mid to late 20s. These guys are all very good athletes for their ages, but they're all well out of their prime and some are playing on fumes after a life of injuries. While the game is very fun and competitive enough, it is tantamount to a "beer and pretzels" RPG game. I have to throttle back a few gears to keep things fun for everyone as I'm the youngest out there and still athletic enough that I can play with 20 year olds. But I love every one of these guys. Good men. Good fathers. Great sportsmen. Great pals. And like I said, still good athletes, especially for their ages. It sates the natural need for community with kindred spirits and people that I very much enjoy being around and have a long, shared history with. It also sates the need to escape mentally from the world and lose myself in the breezy, zen moments inherent to doing competition-lite, physical stuff. Neither experience supplants the other. They're diverse experiences and the crowd and ritual aspects are intrinsic to that diversity. Bringing it back to MO, his RPG and social needs, and how this group placates them, are likely more complex than he even realizes. He may even revel in some of this conflict and competition between he and "Tantrum Guy" and he doesn't even know it. [/QUOTE]

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