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<blockquote data-quote="Caliban" data-source="post: 155610" data-attributes="member: 284">You really don't understand what we are talking about, do you? You are the one trying to reduce everything down to &quot;Attack or not attack&quot;, when the rules are not that simple.&nbsp; You are the one who is falling prey to &quot;Accident Dicto Simpler&quot; (which seems to be a common failing of yours).By the rules, a CDG is not a melee attack.&nbsp; It is a hostile act, but it is not a melee attack as defined by the rules, it is a Miscallaneous Action.&nbsp;&nbsp; Period.&nbsp; Therefore it cannot be substituted for the extra melee attack you gain from Expert Tactician.A fireball is an attack spell, but it is not a melee or ranged attack as defined by the rules.&nbsp;&nbsp; It's not an attack action, it's a magic action.Some spells use a different definition of attack (primarily invisibility and sanctuary), but those spells have their definition of &quot;attack&quot; listed in the spell description (and fireball would be an attack as far as invisibility is concerned, but not as far as sanctuary is concerned).&nbsp;&nbsp; What constitutes an attack for those spells is irrelevant for anything other than those spells, and thus is irrelevant to this discussion.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Caliban, post: 155610, member: 284"] You really don't understand what we are talking about, do you? You are the one trying to reduce everything down to "Attack or not attack", when the rules are not that simple. You are the one who is falling prey to "Accident Dicto Simpler" (which seems to be a common failing of yours). By the rules, a CDG is not a melee attack. It is a hostile act, but it is not a melee attack as defined by the rules, it is a Miscallaneous Action. Period. Therefore it cannot be substituted for the extra melee attack you gain from Expert Tactician. A fireball is an attack spell, but it is not a melee or ranged attack as defined by the rules. It's not an attack action, it's a magic action. Some spells use a different definition of attack (primarily [i]invisibility[/i] and [i]sanctuary[/i]), but those spells have their definition of "attack" listed in the spell description (and [i]fireball[/i] would be an attack as far as [i]invisibility[/i] is concerned, but not as far as [i]sanctuary[/i] is concerned). What constitutes an attack for those spells is irrelevant for anything other than those spells, and thus is irrelevant to this discussion. [/QUOTE]

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