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<blockquote data-quote="Phat Lute" data-source="post: 5332937" data-attributes="member: 84524">I think that the distinction that can be made here is that you have two different character building systems (one with the same level-based chart for everyone that is about as close to the toolkit approach as one can get with classes and levels, and one with class-based leveling charts that is much more linear) with varying degrees of resemblance to the original class builds that use the same name, using the same combat system. I think that's the reason why people have such a huge difference of opinion on 4e and 4ee: some people think of the combat system when you say &quot;the rules&quot; and some people's minds automatically go to class building as &quot;the rules.&quot;&nbsp; Both are correct, but different people put emphasis on different things.&nbsp; That's why we've got one group of people saying that the changes are massive, and another group wondering WTH they're talking about and treating them like they're crazy.If you were looking at just getting Essentials or just getting PHBs, I'd say the changes are pretty significant just in character building.&nbsp; For game mechanics, it's the same system almost exactly, yes.&nbsp; I'd agree there are few things the errata has changed.&nbsp; For character building mechanics, it really does look like a completely different game.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Phat Lute, post: 5332937, member: 84524"] I think that the distinction that can be made here is that you have two different character building systems (one with the same level-based chart for everyone that is about as close to the toolkit approach as one can get with classes and levels, and one with class-based leveling charts that is much more linear) with varying degrees of resemblance to the original class builds that use the same name, using the same combat system. I think that's the reason why people have such a huge difference of opinion on 4e and 4ee: some people think of the combat system when you say "the rules" and some people's minds automatically go to class building as "the rules." Both are correct, but different people put emphasis on different things. That's why we've got one group of people saying that the changes are massive, and another group wondering WTH they're talking about and treating them like they're crazy. If you were looking at just getting Essentials or just getting PHBs, I'd say the changes are pretty significant just in character building. For game mechanics, it's the same system almost exactly, yes. I'd agree there are few things the errata has changed. For character building mechanics, it really does look like a completely different game. [/QUOTE]

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