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<blockquote data-quote="geekgazette" data-source="post: 5333068" data-attributes="member: 75047"><p>First of all both games are good. I won't deny that I am a bit biased because I do prefer Pathfinder over 4e, but I also like 4e. Well actually I like 4e Essentials. </p><p></p><p>Game imbalance only occurs if you let it. If you are playing with a group that can work together, since RPGs are a cooperative endeavor, there is no such thing. Each PC will have their role and it is the DM's job to make sure that each PC has their moment to shine. Regardless I have had no problem with imbalance of any kind in Pathfinder and it is definitely my go to game. Again I am biased, but of the two I have to say PFRPG is the better of the two.</p><p></p><p>That being said, I have found that I really like the 4e Essentials line as well. The newer books are much "easier" and more enjoyable to read than the original core books. Everything about the books is easier for a new player to grasp than it was when the game first came out. I'm teaching my 12 year old 4e using the Essentials and she is having no problems. If you are going the way of 4e, definitely get the Essentials books, IMO. </p><p></p><p>Any RPG is customizable so that should not be an issue. </p><p></p><p>As for cost, all you need for Pathfinder is the Core Rulebook and the Bestiary. </p><p>The [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Core-Rulebook/dp/1601251505/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496511&sr=8-1"]Core Rulebook can be found on Amazon[/ame] for around $30.</p><p>The [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Bestiary/dp/1601251831/ref=sr_1_3?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496511&sr=8-3"]Bestiary can be found on Amazo[/ame]n for around $25.</p><p><strong>Total Cost $55</strong></p><p></p><p>For D&D 4e Essentials all you need is Heroes of the Fallen Lands, Rules Compendium and a Monster Manual. </p><p>On Amazon they run:</p><p>[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Rules-Compendium-Essential-Dungeons-Dragons/dp/0786956216/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496782&sr=8-1"]Rules Compendium [/ame]around $12</p><p>[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Heroes-Fallen-Lands-Essential-Supplement/dp/0786956208/ref=sr_1_3?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496782&sr=8-3"]Heroes of the Fallen Lands[/ame] around $12</p><p>[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Monster-Manual-Rulebook-Dungeons-Dragons/dp/0786954906/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496807&sr=8-1"]Monster Manual [/ame]3 around $22.</p><p>Total Cost around $46.</p><p></p><p>Of course you could just get the Rules Compendium and a DDI membership. The DDi membership will give you access to all the monsters, with updated rules, and nearly every class/race option. </p><p>1<a href="http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Subscription.aspx" target="_blank"> year DDI subscription</a> = $71.40</p><p>Rules Compendium around $12</p><p>Total cost for 1 year = around $84</p><p>You can also "try" DDi for one month at a cost of $9.95/month and then cancel or upgrade.</p><p></p><p>If you are in college and have a school email you can get an Amazon student membership and have free 2 day shipping for items that are Prime eligible. The items will have Prime next to the price. (<a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0786954906/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&qid=1285496807&sr=8-1&condition=new" target="_blank">Example</a>)</p><p></p><p>Honestly no one can tell you which game you will like better. In my opinion Pathfinder is more detailed, in terms of having rules for various situations and allowing personal customization of your character. However, 4e Essentials offers more in terms of pre-customized classes than Pathfinder so that argument is kind of a wash. </p><p>Both games can be used to run any type of game you want, from high magic to low magic campaigns. They can both be cinematic and action backed, full of intrigue or horror. So "style" should not be an issue. You may also here from my fellow 3e/Pathfinder fans that 4e is too much like an MMO. At first glance it may seem that way, but in reality it is not. 4e is a solid RPG and any RPG can be as fun or as dull as you and your group make it. </p><p></p><p>One last point in favor of Pathfinder. Since Pathfinder is compatible with nearly any D&D 3.5 product, you have years worth of material that you can buy cheap and use in your game. Personally I like using the Monster Manuals and Campaign Settings (Eberron, Dragonlance, Forgotten Realms) with Pathfinder. You can pick them up on Amazon or ebay for as little as $5. Currently I'm running Eberron in Pathfinder. Though the 3.5 classes and races are compatible with Pathfinder, I don't use them because they are slightly less powerful in 3.5 than in PFRPG. Though there are tons of free resources for converting 3.5 classes and races to PFRPG. If you go with Pathfinder just go to the <a href="http://www.pathfinderdb.com/home-mainmenu-71#content" target="_blank">Pathfinder Database</a> or google which ever 3.5 to Pathfinder conversion you are looking for. The conversion process is extremely simple and if you get a fair grasp on the rules you can do it yourself in a couple of minutes.</p><p></p><p>Even though I can't help showing my bias in favor of Pathfinder, I also can't speak ill of 4e Essentials. I honestly like them both a great deal. </p><p>I would discourage you from buying the "regular" 4e core rulebooks just because I think the Essentials PHB and CR are far superior. Again that is just my opinion and I'm sure there are 4e players that think I'm crazy for saying that.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="geekgazette, post: 5333068, member: 75047"] First of all both games are good. I won't deny that I am a bit biased because I do prefer Pathfinder over 4e, but I also like 4e. Well actually I like 4e Essentials. Game imbalance only occurs if you let it. If you are playing with a group that can work together, since RPGs are a cooperative endeavor, there is no such thing. Each PC will have their role and it is the DM's job to make sure that each PC has their moment to shine. Regardless I have had no problem with imbalance of any kind in Pathfinder and it is definitely my go to game. Again I am biased, but of the two I have to say PFRPG is the better of the two. That being said, I have found that I really like the 4e Essentials line as well. The newer books are much "easier" and more enjoyable to read than the original core books. Everything about the books is easier for a new player to grasp than it was when the game first came out. I'm teaching my 12 year old 4e using the Essentials and she is having no problems. If you are going the way of 4e, definitely get the Essentials books, IMO. Any RPG is customizable so that should not be an issue. As for cost, all you need for Pathfinder is the Core Rulebook and the Bestiary. The [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Core-Rulebook/dp/1601251505/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496511&sr=8-1"]Core Rulebook can be found on Amazon[/ame] for around $30. The [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Pathfinder-Roleplaying-Game-Bestiary/dp/1601251831/ref=sr_1_3?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496511&sr=8-3"]Bestiary can be found on Amazo[/ame]n for around $25. [B]Total Cost $55[/B] For D&D 4e Essentials all you need is Heroes of the Fallen Lands, Rules Compendium and a Monster Manual. On Amazon they run: [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Rules-Compendium-Essential-Dungeons-Dragons/dp/0786956216/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496782&sr=8-1"]Rules Compendium [/ame]around $12 [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Heroes-Fallen-Lands-Essential-Supplement/dp/0786956208/ref=sr_1_3?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496782&sr=8-3"]Heroes of the Fallen Lands[/ame] around $12 [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Monster-Manual-Rulebook-Dungeons-Dragons/dp/0786954906/ref=sr_1_1?s=gateway&ie=UTF8&qid=1285496807&sr=8-1"]Monster Manual [/ame]3 around $22. Total Cost around $46. Of course you could just get the Rules Compendium and a DDI membership. The DDi membership will give you access to all the monsters, with updated rules, and nearly every class/race option. 1[URL="http://www.wizards.com/DnD/Subscription.aspx"] year DDI subscription[/URL] = $71.40 Rules Compendium around $12 Total cost for 1 year = around $84 You can also "try" DDi for one month at a cost of $9.95/month and then cancel or upgrade. If you are in college and have a school email you can get an Amazon student membership and have free 2 day shipping for items that are Prime eligible. The items will have Prime next to the price. ([URL="http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/0786954906/ref=dp_olp_new?ie=UTF8&qid=1285496807&sr=8-1&condition=new"]Example[/URL]) Honestly no one can tell you which game you will like better. In my opinion Pathfinder is more detailed, in terms of having rules for various situations and allowing personal customization of your character. However, 4e Essentials offers more in terms of pre-customized classes than Pathfinder so that argument is kind of a wash. Both games can be used to run any type of game you want, from high magic to low magic campaigns. They can both be cinematic and action backed, full of intrigue or horror. So "style" should not be an issue. You may also here from my fellow 3e/Pathfinder fans that 4e is too much like an MMO. At first glance it may seem that way, but in reality it is not. 4e is a solid RPG and any RPG can be as fun or as dull as you and your group make it. One last point in favor of Pathfinder. Since Pathfinder is compatible with nearly any D&D 3.5 product, you have years worth of material that you can buy cheap and use in your game. Personally I like using the Monster Manuals and Campaign Settings (Eberron, Dragonlance, Forgotten Realms) with Pathfinder. You can pick them up on Amazon or ebay for as little as $5. Currently I'm running Eberron in Pathfinder. Though the 3.5 classes and races are compatible with Pathfinder, I don't use them because they are slightly less powerful in 3.5 than in PFRPG. Though there are tons of free resources for converting 3.5 classes and races to PFRPG. If you go with Pathfinder just go to the [URL="http://www.pathfinderdb.com/home-mainmenu-71#content"]Pathfinder Database[/URL] or google which ever 3.5 to Pathfinder conversion you are looking for. The conversion process is extremely simple and if you get a fair grasp on the rules you can do it yourself in a couple of minutes. Even though I can't help showing my bias in favor of Pathfinder, I also can't speak ill of 4e Essentials. I honestly like them both a great deal. I would discourage you from buying the "regular" 4e core rulebooks just because I think the Essentials PHB and CR are far superior. Again that is just my opinion and I'm sure there are 4e players that think I'm crazy for saying that. [/QUOTE]
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