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<blockquote data-quote="Patman21967" data-source="post: 2192578" data-attributes="member: 19260">Look, here is my .02 on the matter. The players should have been given hints along the way, to provide for a possible solution. Funnelling them into a &quot;solve it or it's over&quot; is dumb. They should have 2 options, solve it using the clues that the GM provided, or admit defeat to the powerful Lich/Dm, and continue something else, and let the &quot;players&quot; continue to work on the puzzle. When, and IF they solve it, they can come back kill the Lich and do whatever they like to do with evil temples. I happen to agree with Auld Grumpy, that things like this should not be solved with the roll of the die...When you have to negotiate with the Dragon to spare your lives, do you just pick up the 20 and roll it?&nbsp; I have a +20 to my diplomacy, so I win...People can play any way they want, and people will always criticize others modes of play. But really, if all you want to experience from the hobby of RolePlaying is rolling dice to see who gets a better score, then by all means, have fun....but there is a lot more to these games then just being a &quot;powergamer&quot;I remember years ago a girlfriend used to ask me, when I would see her after our Sunday game, &quot;Who won?&quot; I feel like alot of people veiw this hobby in that regard....Us vs. the DM...Sorry is I offended anyonePat</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Patman21967, post: 2192578, member: 19260"] Look, here is my .02 on the matter. The players should have been given hints along the way, to provide for a possible solution. Funnelling them into a "solve it or it's over" is dumb. They should have 2 options, solve it using the clues that the GM provided, or admit defeat to the powerful Lich/Dm, and continue something else, and let the "players" continue to work on the puzzle. When, and IF they solve it, they can come back kill the Lich and do whatever they like to do with evil temples. I happen to agree with Auld Grumpy, that things like this should not be solved with the roll of the die...When you have to negotiate with the Dragon to spare your lives, do you just pick up the 20 and roll it? I have a +20 to my diplomacy, so I win... People can play any way they want, and people will always criticize others modes of play. But really, if all you want to experience from the hobby of RolePlaying is rolling dice to see who gets a better score, then by all means, have fun....but there is a lot more to these games then just being a "powergamer" I remember years ago a girlfriend used to ask me, when I would see her after our Sunday game, "Who won?" I feel like alot of people veiw this hobby in that regard....Us vs. the DM... Sorry is I offended anyone Pat [/QUOTE]

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