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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Aulirophile" data-source="post: 5411956" data-attributes="member: 86312">Um, no, they aren't different. They have the exact same cause, mathematically, because they use the same assumptions and the same system. They both stem from the exact same scaling issue. Hell, the only reason AC doesn't have the NAD problem is Masterwork armor's AC bonus (and even that needed some fixes, which came out in AV). A quick look at the math behind the combat system is all you need to prove that. The difference is not trivial, the difference is significant mathematically (something you've proven is not your strong suit). Make your point without being insulting. Snarky little asides like this do nothing for your argument, and break our rules. Don't make them, please. ~ Piratecat  Your "experience" and anecdotal evidence does not stack up against math or the clear evidence that the developers consider it a mandatory feat based on the fact that they give it out for free in their home games.Again, it isn't a matter of "easy" or "hard" (which is something a good DM can control trivially) it is a matter of "Does the system scale as intended?" The answer is it doesn't. Expertise makes it scale as intended. When a system doesn't work the way you meant it to (in this case PCs hitting on a certain number on the die) and then you fix it (in this case by releasing the expertise feats), that means the system was broken. I'm obviously not using "broken" in the "hey, the game is unplayable!" way, I'm using it in the sense that the game's math isn't what the creators and developers of the game intended for it to be.</blockquote>

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