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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Hypersmurf" data-source="post: 2244523" data-attributes="member: 1656">That's right.Right.  And 'grapple' has the footnote.Well, more information is required.  They take the place of an attack, so they can be used in any situation you are permitted an attack.  That's not limited to the Attack or Full Attack action; you can also make attacks as part of the Charge action, or as an AoO, for example.But you can't Charge while you're grappling, and you threaten no area while you're grappling.  So effectively, we're back to the attack or full attack action.Patryn - each of the grappling actions takes the place of an attack, but unless you're taking the attack action or full attack action, you have no attacks for the actions to take the place of.There's nothing wrong with fighting defensively while grappling if you're using the 'Attack your opponent' option - you are attacking, and using the attack or full attack action.If you're using the 'Damage your opponent' option, it's less clear whether you fit the requirement of 'when attacking' - you are performing the option in place of attacking, and it's not explicit that you're still literally attacking.Combat Expertise is less certain - since neither of you threaten the other while grappling, you are not 'in melee combat' unless an enemy external to the grapple threatens you.-Hyp.</blockquote>