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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 4550578" data-attributes="member: 2525">I am trying to decide between two builds, and I wanted some advice from folks who have played wizards more than I have.Both builds will use humans, with point buy, and I would prefer an illusion theme if possible.  I will be playing with a fairly well balanced group, and all the roles except controller are covered by the group.The first build is an Orb wizard.  Int 16 (18), Wis 16, Con 12, Chr 12 (for Spell Focus later), Dex 10, Str. 8.  To gain advantage from the orb, this wizard will select Sleep as one of his daily spells (and flaming sphere as the other one), and Thunderwave as an at-will (to take advantage of the higher wis).  The other two at-wills will be illusory ambush (or cloud of daggers, if someone can talk me into that) and scorching burst.  Encounter will be grasping shadows.  Eventually, there will be more spells that benefit from a high wisdom, and of course the orb ability will come into play more at higher levels with the reduction to saving throws.  Feats are likely improved initiative (to try and get a grasping shadows off early at a group of baddies) and action surge (to spend on my daily most often, to make sure it hits).This wizard has more potential to deal out deadly spells, but a lot of that is in the future.  For example, his sleep spell may well essentially kill things once a day.  However, this wizard also lacks hit points, and has a low AC.The  second wizard is a staff wielding one.  Mostly the same build as before, but the two feats will be leather armor and hide armor, for a total AC of 18 at first level.  Wis and Con will be flipped, so he will have more hit points and his staff power will be more effective.  This wizard will be harder to hit, and more durable.  However, his potential to deal out death in the future is a bit lower, he will almost never go first and thus will have a hard time hitting a group of enemies at the beginning, and his daily will miss more often without action surge.  Also his thunderwave only pushes one square, and he cannot deny saving throws like the orb wizard can.So, what do you think?  Which build do you think tends to be better in play? Any suggestions?</blockquote>

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