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<blockquote data-quote="ValhallaGH" data-source="post: 5169642" data-attributes="member: 41187"><p>Some of my reaction is leftovers from my time with Iron Heroes. When a single ranged attack is doing 1d8+4d6+18 (18-20, x4) at level 12 and you're getting four shots per full attack (plus rapid shot), RS gets a wee bit insane. And it's worse when most of your foes are melee, and you're picking them off from 600+ feet (free attacks for about 5 rounds).</p><p></p><p>Still, it's an amazingly good feat, one of the strongest in the game, and the only thing that keeps it in check is the general weakness of ranged combat (and the high feat threshold of that style).</p><p></p><p>Actually, I was using TB for my (lost and lamented) calculations. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f600.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":D" title="Big grin :D" data-smilie="8"data-shortname=":D" /> The real difference is in the action economy. Two TWF attacks is generally as damaging as one THF attack, so the 2 / 4 ratio full attack is pretty spot on. (Kudos!)</p><p>Now, the 2 / 6 ratio is a bit wonky, but Whirling Frenzy is the strongest of the rages, and when you <em>haste</em> one of those guys .....</p><p>Still, tons of melee damage isn't the end of the world. It's nasty but not insurmountable. I just don't like how Whirling is so much a better option than the Sturdy Rage. [/nit pick]</p><p></p><p></p><p>My experience with TB (up to fifth level, so far) is that all builds are pretty darn viable. The halfling Sword & Board fighter started pretty weak, but just hit her stride as one of the murder-machines (and has long been the hardest to kill).</p><p>Damage was spotty (except the great ax barbarian) until level four. Now, everyone is killing most of the time. Of course, three of my players were novices and they've learned quite a bit about being more effective in a straight combat.</p><p>For Reference: Halfling S&B fighter, half-elf TWF rogue, half-orc THF barbarian (deceased), half-orc TWF barbarian (double ax), human cleric (St. Cuthbert - replaced the dead barbarian).</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ValhallaGH, post: 5169642, member: 41187"] Some of my reaction is leftovers from my time with Iron Heroes. When a single ranged attack is doing 1d8+4d6+18 (18-20, x4) at level 12 and you're getting four shots per full attack (plus rapid shot), RS gets a wee bit insane. And it's worse when most of your foes are melee, and you're picking them off from 600+ feet (free attacks for about 5 rounds). Still, it's an amazingly good feat, one of the strongest in the game, and the only thing that keeps it in check is the general weakness of ranged combat (and the high feat threshold of that style). Actually, I was using TB for my (lost and lamented) calculations. :D The real difference is in the action economy. Two TWF attacks is generally as damaging as one THF attack, so the 2 / 4 ratio full attack is pretty spot on. (Kudos!) Now, the 2 / 6 ratio is a bit wonky, but Whirling Frenzy is the strongest of the rages, and when you [I]haste[/I] one of those guys ..... Still, tons of melee damage isn't the end of the world. It's nasty but not insurmountable. I just don't like how Whirling is so much a better option than the Sturdy Rage. [/nit pick] My experience with TB (up to fifth level, so far) is that all builds are pretty darn viable. The halfling Sword & Board fighter started pretty weak, but just hit her stride as one of the murder-machines (and has long been the hardest to kill). Damage was spotty (except the great ax barbarian) until level four. Now, everyone is killing most of the time. Of course, three of my players were novices and they've learned quite a bit about being more effective in a straight combat. For Reference: Halfling S&B fighter, half-elf TWF rogue, half-orc THF barbarian (deceased), half-orc TWF barbarian (double ax), human cleric (St. Cuthbert - replaced the dead barbarian). [/QUOTE]
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