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Message: <blockquote data-quote="The Souljourner" data-source="post: 3721500" data-attributes="member: 1622">Maybe what they should do is split up the idea of the jack of all trades and the music based caster.  I think most people dislike the bard because of one sentence "I start singing".   If you have a jack of all trades who is not a bard, (basically replace bardic music with something else), you don't get that stigma, and if you also have another class that's a kickass spellsinger who happens to also be skillful in his spare time, that would be fantastic.  Both of those sound like they probably go in non-PHB books, though.So, I revise my earlier statement... take the bard as he is out of 4e, but make him into two different base classes later... and make sure they really kick ass.-Nate</blockquote>