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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Rune" data-source="post: 6122164" data-attributes="member: 67">So, the latest L&L tells us that feats are being designed so that players can choose whether they want to use them or not, but the inclusion of skills will have to be the DM's decision, because the DCs will have to be higher.This need not be so.  If a skill provides a baseline minimum proficiency, rather than expanding upon the maximum, the DCs won't be effected at all.The "Skilled" Option:It could be pretty simple, actually.  Instead of the normal ability check at 1d20 + ability modifier, a trained skill would allow the player to make the check at 1d10 + 10 + ability modifier.  A character's highest degree of success is still bound by natural talent, but the chance of failure is greatly reduced.The "Skill-Levels" Option:If you want to be able to increase skill as the character levels, you could change the die type (and corresponding bonus) at different points.  The lowest level of the skill would provide 1d12 + 8 + ability modifier.  The next level would provide 1d10 + 10 + ability modifier.  Then, 1d8 + 12 + ability modifier.  Followed by 1d6 + 14 + ability modifier.  And, finally, the highest level of mastery: 1d4 + 16 + ability modifier.  (The really nice thing about this approach is that, at the master level, you'd really only need to roll for the hardest tasks; most others would automatically succeed.)These tiers could easily be given titles, such as these provided by    [MENTION=61749]Jeff Carlsen[/MENTION]: Apprentice, Journeyman, Professional, Expert, and Master.So, how to balance the character that has, say, 4 of these skills with one who doesn't?  I'm sure there are plenty of ways.  Personally, I'd like to see something that more or less takes the place of the skills--that is, a simplified means of making task accomplishment easier.The "Non-Skilled" Option:This is how I'd do it:  For every trained skill that the character would be entitled to, but chooses not to, I'd give them one use of a "Succeed when you need to" ability (that, when expended, would grant automatic success to an ability check or contest).  Each use, once expended, would only recharge after the character has gained a new level.Of course, this leaves one issue.  Over the course of this thread, it has become clear that some folk actually like rolling high results with their skilled characters to show off how specialized they are.  For them, capping all ability checks (even skilled ones) at the same maximum (that is, 20 + ability modifier) is simply not satisfying.The "Exceed the Cap" Option:A simple solution to that problem would be to add the following option to exceed the cap: If you roll the maximum value for your ability check, something crazy good happens (or the die explodes, if your player really likes rolling dice!).As this option would also apply to characters opting out of the skill system, it would still be balanced with such a character who has the "Succeed when you need to" ability (or something similar).  Also, it would mean that more skilled characters would tend to exceed that gap more frequently than less (or non-) skilled characters, as the dice used would be smaller.</blockquote>

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