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Detailed sequence for an attack
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<blockquote data-quote="deleteme123456" data-source="post: 4756599" data-attributes="member: 65832"><p>Sure, wizards could have done this, but hey, that would be... well... out-of-character for them. They're chaotic, and this is the realm of lawful. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>I sat down, partly for personal amusement, partly for trying to figure out the rules before someone in the party comes up with some crazy unexpected combination of powers that leaves us scratching our heads for 30 minutes, and partly just to see if it could be done, and wrote out a draft of what I thought all the steps in making an attack were.</p><p></p><p>Sure, I could just look at PH 2xx or whatever, but that's not nearly enough detail, and it's very ambiguous when you start talking about triggers (more than half the steps here involve them).</p><p></p><p>So, I'm posting what I have and asking for feedback. The goal is NOT to define what an attack is (I have no intention of starting that holy war) but to define "given that we are making an attack, how do we proceed, and when are the correct times for triggers to fire?" I'm trying to stick to RAW as much as possible, but willing to fudge it if it becomes obvious that RAW simply leaves too many holes.</p><p></p><p>THE SEQUENCE (in greater detail than you hope you ever need)</p><p></p><p></p><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Declare attack:</span><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Identify <strong>power</strong> being used</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Identify <strong>target(s)</strong> of power and/or the <strong>origin square</strong> and <strong>area of effect</strong> for burst/blast powers</span><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">It is not impossible that there could exist a power which changes the area of effect as a reaction, something like "immediate reaction to being targeted by an area or close power, exclude your square and squares in a close burst 1 around you from the effect"; this is adequately covered by step 2</span></li> </ol> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Identify <strong>additional powers/properties</strong> being used as part of this power such as which weapon or implement you are using (most of the time this should be obvious)</span></li> </ol> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White"><strong>Interrupts</strong>*, <strong>Opportunity*, No actions, and Free actions</strong> that trigger on "<strong>makes an attack</strong>" or "<strong>is targeted by an attack</strong>" occur.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Follow only the step(s) for your attack type:</span><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">(<strong>AREA</strong> and <strong>CLOSE</strong>) Roll <strong>damage</strong>. <strong>No action </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free action</strong></span><span style="color: White"> powers that trigger on a "damage roll" or any "roll" may be used.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">(<strong>AREA</strong> and <strong>CLOSE</strong>) Roll <strong>attack</strong> against<strong> valid target of your choice</strong> within burst or blast which has not been previously targeted by this use of the power.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">(<strong>MELEE</strong> and <strong>RANGED</strong>) Roll <strong>attack and damage</strong> against <strong>valid target of your choice</strong> within range/reach which has not been previously targeted the maximum number of allowable times by this power. </span><span style="color: White"><strong>No action </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free action</strong></span><span style="color: White"> powers that trigger on a "damage roll" or any "roll" may be used.</span></li> </ol> </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White"><strong>No action </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free action</strong></span><span style="color: White"> powers that trigger on an "attack roll" or any "roll" may be used (generally, unless the power explicitly states you must use it before you know if the attack hits, you should wait until step 6).</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Determine if attack <strong>hits</strong>. (The target must still be a valid target, within range/reach/area of effect, you must have line of effect to it, you may require line of sight to it, and your attack roll plus all applicable modifiers must meet or exceed its defense.)</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White"><strong>No action </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free action</strong></span><span style="color: White"> powers that trigger on an "attack roll" or any "roll" may be used, unless the power explicitly states you must use it before you know if the attack hits. If any are used, return to step 5.<br /> </span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White"><strong>Interrupts</strong>*, <strong>No action, </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free actions </strong>that trigger on "<strong>is hit / missed by an attack</strong>" occur. If any are used, return to step 5.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">If applicable, <strong>deal damage</strong> and <strong>impose conditions</strong>. (Actions taken by the enemy in steps 6 or 7 may have invalidated it as a target, changed a hit into a miss, redirected the damage, etc.)</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White"><strong>Reactions</strong></span><span style="color: White">*, <strong>No action</strong></span><span style="color: White">, and <strong>Free actions </strong>that trigger on "<strong>is hit / missed by an attack</strong>" </span><span style="color: White">or <strong>"takes damage" </strong>occur. </span><span style="color: White">Other <strong>similar triggers</strong></span><span style="color: White">, such as "becomes bloodied" "is reduced to 0 HP" "dies" etc. <strong>also trigger here</strong></span><span style="color: White">, and <strong>Immediate, No, </strong></span><span style="color: White">and <strong>Free action </strong></span><span style="color: White">powers keying on those triggers may be used.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">Follow only the step for your attack type:</span><ol> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">(<strong>AREA</strong> and <strong>CLOSE</strong>) If there are any <strong>valid targets left</strong> in the burst or blast, return to <strong>step 3b</strong>.</span></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ol"><span style="color: White">(<strong>MELEE </strong>and <strong>RANGE</strong>) If the power has <strong>additional targets/uses left</strong>, return to <strong>step 3c</strong>.</span></li> </ol> </li> </ol><p>* Immediate and Opportunity Actions can't be used on your own turn.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="deleteme123456, post: 4756599, member: 65832"] Sure, wizards could have done this, but hey, that would be... well... out-of-character for them. They're chaotic, and this is the realm of lawful. :) I sat down, partly for personal amusement, partly for trying to figure out the rules before someone in the party comes up with some crazy unexpected combination of powers that leaves us scratching our heads for 30 minutes, and partly just to see if it could be done, and wrote out a draft of what I thought all the steps in making an attack were. Sure, I could just look at PH 2xx or whatever, but that's not nearly enough detail, and it's very ambiguous when you start talking about triggers (more than half the steps here involve them). So, I'm posting what I have and asking for feedback. The goal is NOT to define what an attack is (I have no intention of starting that holy war) but to define "given that we are making an attack, how do we proceed, and when are the correct times for triggers to fire?" I'm trying to stick to RAW as much as possible, but willing to fudge it if it becomes obvious that RAW simply leaves too many holes. THE SEQUENCE (in greater detail than you hope you ever need) [LIST=1] [*][COLOR=White]Declare attack:[/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][COLOR=White]Identify [B]power[/B] being used[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]Identify [B]target(s)[/B] of power and/or the [B]origin square[/B] and [B]area of effect[/B] for burst/blast powers[/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][COLOR=White]It is not impossible that there could exist a power which changes the area of effect as a reaction, something like "immediate reaction to being targeted by an area or close power, exclude your square and squares in a close burst 1 around you from the effect"; this is adequately covered by step 2[/COLOR] [/LIST] [*][COLOR=White]Identify [B]additional powers/properties[/B] being used as part of this power such as which weapon or implement you are using (most of the time this should be obvious)[/COLOR] [/LIST] [*][COLOR=White][B]Interrupts[/B]*, [B]Opportunity*, No actions, and Free actions[/B] that trigger on "[B]makes an attack[/B]" or "[B]is targeted by an attack[/B]" occur.[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]Follow only the step(s) for your attack type:[/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][COLOR=White]([B]AREA[/B] and [B]CLOSE[/B]) Roll [B]damage[/B]. [B]No action [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free action[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White] powers that trigger on a "damage roll" or any "roll" may be used.[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]([B]AREA[/B] and [B]CLOSE[/B]) Roll [B]attack[/B] against[B] valid target of your choice[/B] within burst or blast which has not been previously targeted by this use of the power.[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]([B]MELEE[/B] and [B]RANGED[/B]) Roll [B]attack and damage[/B] against [B]valid target of your choice[/B] within range/reach which has not been previously targeted the maximum number of allowable times by this power. [/COLOR][COLOR=White][B]No action [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free action[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White] powers that trigger on a "damage roll" or any "roll" may be used.[/COLOR] [/LIST] [*][COLOR=White][B]No action [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free action[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White] powers that trigger on an "attack roll" or any "roll" may be used (generally, unless the power explicitly states you must use it before you know if the attack hits, you should wait until step 6).[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]Determine if attack [B]hits[/B]. (The target must still be a valid target, within range/reach/area of effect, you must have line of effect to it, you may require line of sight to it, and your attack roll plus all applicable modifiers must meet or exceed its defense.)[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White][B]No action [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free action[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White] powers that trigger on an "attack roll" or any "roll" may be used, unless the power explicitly states you must use it before you know if the attack hits. If any are used, return to step 5. [/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White][B]Interrupts[/B]*, [B]No action, [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free actions [/B]that trigger on "[B]is hit / missed by an attack[/B]" occur. If any are used, return to step 5.[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]If applicable, [B]deal damage[/B] and [B]impose conditions[/B]. (Actions taken by the enemy in steps 6 or 7 may have invalidated it as a target, changed a hit into a miss, redirected the damage, etc.)[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White][B]Reactions[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]*, [B]No action[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White], and [B]Free actions [/B]that trigger on "[B]is hit / missed by an attack[/B]" [/COLOR][COLOR=White]or [B]"takes damage" [/B]occur. [/COLOR][COLOR=White]Other [B]similar triggers[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White], such as "becomes bloodied" "is reduced to 0 HP" "dies" etc. [B]also trigger here[/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White], and [B]Immediate, No, [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]and [B]Free action [/B][/COLOR][COLOR=White]powers keying on those triggers may be used.[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]Follow only the step for your attack type:[/COLOR] [LIST=1] [*][COLOR=White]([B]AREA[/B] and [B]CLOSE[/B]) If there are any [B]valid targets left[/B] in the burst or blast, return to [B]step 3b[/B].[/COLOR] [*][COLOR=White]([B]MELEE [/B]and [B]RANGE[/B]) If the power has [B]additional targets/uses left[/B], return to [B]step 3c[/B].[/COLOR] [/LIST] [/LIST] * Immediate and Opportunity Actions can't be used on your own turn. [/QUOTE]
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