Detect Magic

[gyor]

I really like how 4e handled Detect Magic, as an ability of being trained in arcana (think spellcraft for previous edition lovers).

Not only would I like that to continue, I'd like other skills to work like that.

For example, I'd like the religion skill be able to be used for a detect spiritual imprint, which would work like detect undead, plus spiritual significate beings, events, and holy relics.

I can see a Psioncraft skill as well, maybe fortune telling, and other skills with a more mystical basis, not just more mudane skills and I'd like them to be more then just knoweldge checks. Not stuff that should be reserved for rituals and spells, but more stuff that comes as by product of knoweldge and an innate sensitivity.

Anyone have any ideas on this?

 

[steeldragons]

I like Detect Magic as a cantrip...with spontaneous castings ability. Something..probably the FIRST "real magic" thing you were taught as an apprentice....find other magic!

Can't do it "all day", but a few times at least...

 

[TwinBahamut]

I'm fine with any version of detect magic that doesn't lead to the massive amount of effort 3E went to in order to define whether any given thing was magic or not (that was arguably still incomplete). Every last thing had to be defined as Extraordinary or supernatural, the "magicness" of every object had to be carefully laid out... I suppose this is more a side effect of antimagic fields (may the coffin of stone and lead they are trapped in never break) more than detect magic, but detect magic can lead to that kind of thing if you are not careful.

With all the supernatural stuff that is seen in any fantasy world that escapes the term "low magic", a detect magic spell would either be overly useful because it highlights the magical nature of everything around you, or useless because you get too many false signals (depending on implementation). I guess that's why folding it in with skills as something that can be somewhat handwaved, rather than hard-coding it in as a power or spell with detailed implementation would be my preference.

 

[boredgremlin]

I always did it like this.

Magical classes could just sense magic. If there was a spell around or distinctly magical critters have lived there for a long time you might tell the character that he senses powerful magic in the area.

Spell knowledge would refine it further with a good check. I.E. that magic seems like some sort of warding spell, or this area has been home to powerful magical entities recently.

Detect magic spell would be more specific yet.

Something like, you sense a trap spell of some sort on that door over there. Or this area has many spirits in it, or corporeal undead.

And multiple skills could add in as well.

For instance religion might lead to.... this area was used as a summoning room for beings from another world that were called to serve priests of the dark lord, eatssomebabies.

Or nature might be combined to give them something like.... This sort of magical essence in this area feels like some kind of dragon kin.


I liked the RP possibilities as players went through the actions of discovering the presence of magic and trying to determine what it is.

 

[Raith5]

Agree with the OP, I like to see significant interplay between skills and magic effects. I dont like the automatic - almost CSI ultraviolet light - of detect magic as a spell.

I also like the way some rituals in 4th ed interacted with skills - but much more needed to be done about this. Detect magic as an arcane skill was one of the many small unheralded things that 4th ed did that went against the gamist criticism often leveled against it.

 

[Crazy Jerome]

For example, I'd like the religion skill be able to be used for a detect spiritual imprint, which would work like detect undead, plus spiritual significate beings, events, and holy relics.

We already use religion skill like this in 4E as a house rules. Works well for us, at least in the heroic tier.

For detect magic in particular, I'd like a mix of the 4E arcana rules and the Arcana Evolved "object lore" type abilities. Basically, each time you cast on a given item, you got new information, such as who last owned the item, how long ago, who had it before them, when it was last used, etc. These spells worked on any item, not just magic, of course.

Then I'd use arcana to detect magic and basic functions, but "object lore" castings to dig out the remaining information, or at least clues on where or who to consult to get that information.

In 4E terms, object lore would make a good low-cost, long casting time, ritual. It means that if you find a +3 flaming longsword with some other ability, you know the basic stats with a decent arcana check, but not the command words for the flaming on, flaming off, and that other ability. But now you have a framework to find that out in a reasonable timeframe, once the characters make the attempt. And instead of identify, or other such "cast the spell, get the info" options, the real cost is getting the old wizard that made it to fess up, or find his notes, or such.

 

[gyor]

I'd also like how with Religion you could build holy symbols.

Also I'd like to see the religion skill used in exerosisms. The power of Eatssomebabies compels you! Out demon, the power of Eatssomebabies compels you!

I'd also use Acana for read magic as well, but only for arcane text, religious ones would you religion.

Also for a psicraft check, I'd allow the characters to feed false info to creature probing thier minds.

I'd also bring back autohypnosis skill.

also I wonder what happens if you take the haggle skill, will the system allow to save silver compared to your allows?

What about a the heal skill, how far in actual healing will it be able to go?

Maybe the Heal skill is what they were talking about when they said clerics/leaders should not be required for every party. Class abilities would still be required for in combat beyond stabilizing, but out of combat it maybe be possible to use the heal skill to some degree.

I have to admit I like the listless skills idea, it allows you to become really inventive.