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Diplomacy Smackdown

Malin Genie

First Post
Using the standard smackdown rules (16th level, core rulebooks + builder books only, standard DMG or builder book magic items only) how high can you get a Diplomacy check?

For a single check:

Bard14/Mindbender1/Rogue1 (for the Inuuendo ranks)

19 ranks Diplomacy +19
Trustworthy, Alluring +4
Mindbender bonus to Diplomacy +6
Cha 18 starting +4 raises +6
Armour of Command (+4 competence bonus to Cha) +2
Cloak of Charisma +6 (+6 enhancement bonus to Cha) +3
Luckstone +1
Cast Improvisation (+28 to one, or spread out among several, checks) +28

Total +69 bonus

or for multiple checks

Bard 7/Rogue 1/Mindbender 1/Dread Pirate 7

+19 +4 +6 +7 (dread pirate) +6 +2 +3 +1 = +51
 

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Kershek said:

By turning to page 242 in your trusted DMG. You will see on the table that items that grant a skill bonus havea cost of bonus squared x 20gp. 30 squared equals 900. 900 x 20 = 18,000

I've heard that items with a larger bonus use different rules that are presented in the ELH. As I don't have that yet, I can't say for certain.

Also, if 18k seems steep, you can reduce the price by following the guidelines on pg 243 of the DMG.
 

So basically a 4th or 5th level character can use Craft Wondrous Item to create an Amulet of Gather Info +20 for 8,000 gold and suddenly become a schmoozing wonder?

Or a 3rd level wizard can create an Amulet of Spellcraft +10 for only 2,000 gold and never have to worry about spellcraft checks, assuming an INT 16 and max ranks making him a natural +9 before the Amulet?

Or he can create an Amulet of Concentration +10 for only 2,000 gold and never have to worry about casting defensively?

Or he can create an Amulet of Search +10 for a rogue to always find traps with a take 10, or an Amulet of Disable Device to always disable traps, or an Amulet of Escape Artist +10 to easily escape any grapples, etc., etc.

Is this right? Seems quite unbalanced to me for the price.
 

Kershek said:
So basically a 4th or 5th level character can use Craft Wondrous Item to create an Amulet of Gather Info +20 for 8,000 gold and suddenly become a schmoozing wonder?

Or a 3rd level wizard can create an Amulet of Spellcraft +10 for only 2,000 gold and never have to worry about spellcraft checks, assuming an INT 16 and max ranks making him a natural +9 before the Amulet?

Or he can create an Amulet of Concentration +10 for only 2,000 gold and never have to worry about casting defensively?

Or he can create an Amulet of Search +10 for a rogue to always find traps with a take 10, or an Amulet of Disable Device to always disable traps, or an Amulet of Escape Artist +10 to easily escape any grapples, etc., etc.

Is this right? Seems quite unbalanced to me for the price.

As always you can Rule 0 anything, but as the core rules are it is correct. Skills are important, but not game breakers so even with high bonuses in one or two skills the characters should still be challenged by the appropriate monsters.
 

This is not correct.

These "rules" are presented as Guidelines in the Dungeons Master Guide.
If you take the feat and want to build an item, ask your DM,
a) if he allows it at all
b) at what price.
The item creation "rules" are not in the Players Handbook, and there is a good reason for it.

Never forget this. If you do, anyone (well, at least a 3rd level wizard with the Craft Wondrous Item feat and the appropriate spell) could create "Gloves of True Strike" that gain a permanent +20 insight bonus to attacks for mere 2.000 credits.

Mustrum Ridcully
 
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Originally Posted in the Sultans of Smack thread:
Charlatan Smackdown
Originally Posted by Roland

Roleplaying Smackdown. Or Bluff is your friend. Or Dms are my Bitc*es.

Or Liar Smackdown. But I prefer "Charlatan Smackdown".

It's a simple smackdown, with few magic objects and without Prc......

Well, when I build a character, I try to make him without too many magic objects.

Not burst, flaming, vorpal, speed and so on...

Your character must be strong without any Dm's aid. This is the way to the real smack!

For this smack you need Psionics Handbook, Song and Silence, FRCS and DMG.

Human Psion (Telepath) 16th level

Skills: 19 to Bluff or to Diplomacy.
Cha 18 (+4) (Hey! It's a smackdown!)
Levels +4 so +2 to Cha
+5 Inherent so +2 to Cha (25500 gp)
Psycristal: Liar +2 to Bluff (or Friendly +2 to Diplomacy)

1st level: Spell Focus +2 to Bluff + Greater Spell Focus Bluff +4 (if you want a diplomat, choose Diplomacy, +4)

<editor's note: Maybe he meant Skill Focus and Greater (??) Skill Focus?>

3rd level: Street Smarts +2 to Bluff and Gather Information (or if you want a diplomat, choose Smooth talk, +2) (FRCS)
6th level: Silver Palm +2 to bluff and +2 to Appraise (FRCS)
9th level: Psychoanalist: +2 to Bluff, Diplomacy and Intimidate checks
12th level: Charlatan +2 to Bluff and Disguise Checks (Trustworthy for Diplomacy) (Song & Silence)
15th level: Persuasive +2 to Bluff and Intimidate checks. (Song & Silence)
(For a diplomat player, 5 ranks in bluff give a +2 synergy to Diplomacy checks)

Cloak of Charisma +6 Enanchment bonus 36000 gp.
Potion of Glibness +30 to Bluff checks (500 gp) (Ok, maybe it's broken, but it's a core item!) An' it's cheap.
Shield: Command, +4 competence bonus to charisma. (4465 gp, I think)
Breastplate of Command, +2 circumstance bonus on charisma checks and skills (21600 gp)

Conceal Thoughts +20 (PsionH) (16 h) unammed bonus

(Optional +3 to Cha for age)

Total gp: 88065 gp.
-----------

Skill Check:

1d20
+19 Bluff skill
+4 Cha 18
+2 Levels
+2 Inherent
+2 Psycristal
+4 Greater Spell Focus
+2 Street Smarts
+2 Silver Palm
+2 Psychoanalist
+2 Charlatan
+2 Persuasive
+3 Cloak of Cha.
+30 Potion of GLibness
+2 Buckler of Command
+2 Breastplate of Command
+20 Conceal Thoughts
+2 optional for age (yes, It's +3 to Cha, but +5 inherent to Cha for the Tome...))
---

<editor’s note: I’m pretty sure “Greater Spell Focus” was an error and comes out of there, unless it somehow can be ruled to affect the Conceal Thoughts power.>

Total: 1d20+100 (0r 102 optional aged character). With only a standard action.

No preparing rounds.

So with 2 on a roll, you have a 102 (104) Bluff ("or" only 50, I think, to Diplomacy Checks).

ps: Take for example Phlogiston, the uber Half-fire elemental/half-great wyrm red dragon drd20, cr47, his sense motive is 42+30 (impossible check, I think)=72+1d20 (A note: Sense motive isn't a class skill for a dragon! Bwahahaha)

"Yeah, yeah I'm a lammasu polymorphed in an halfling by an evil mage.. etc etc.. pfui.
How many times must I repeat this phrase, sigh? What? Sure, I'm trustworthy!"

Well, are we trying to influence an Npc? Okkaaayyy

1d20
+4 Charisma Modifier
+2 levels
+2 Inherent
+2 Psychoanalist
+3 Cloak of Cha
+2 Buckler, Shield
+2 Breastplate of Command
optional +3 age
---

Total=1d20+22 to Charisma Checks.

<editor’s note: 19 ranks of diplomacy will add directly to that roll>

A friendly Npc becomes Helpful.
An indifferent Npc become helpful with 8 on a roll.
An unfriendly Npc becomes helpful with 18 on a roll (ughhh) or friendly with 3.
Am hostile Npc becomes indifferent with 3, friendly with 13.
 
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