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Disappointed in 4e
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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 4549440" data-attributes="member: 42582"><p>You seem to be presupposing here that the game mechanics do not make player announcement sufficient for success of action resolution.</p><p></p><p></p><p>You seem to be presupposing here that what counts as "smart play" is the same in all RPGs (or at least all versions of D&D).</p><p></p><p>Both presuppositions are contentious. Some 4e mechanics do permit player announcement to be sufficient for success. And smart play in 4e is not the same as in 1st ed AD&D. In particular, in the former game it is sometimes "smart play" for a player to have his/her PC do things that are not necessarily smart from the PC's point of view - the game mechanics are designed to sometimes reward what is, from the point of view of the PC, rashness or excessive flamboyance. The same sort of thinking underlies the hit point mechanics.</p><p></p><p>And I still reiterate - if you are playing an RPG, and there is no mechanical reason not to do certain things to maintain verisimilitude, and you as a player choose not to, and then you are irritated by the lack of verisimilitude - well, you have no one but yourself to blame.</p><p></p><p>But it can be made verisimilitudinous in any event: if you absolutely won't refrain from pushing on to the next tomb because the mechanics don't <em>require</em> your PC to rest, then in the gameworld your PC is such a driven tomb-looter that no amount of physical debilitation slows him/her down. Presumably your PC is also the sort of sociopath who won't take a break on the weekend to have lunch with friends and family, because there is no game-mechanical advantage to doing that either. I'm not sure I want to play that PC, but I can see that it has a place in the gameworld of D&D.</p><p></p><p>Now I have no objection to an RPG that does <em>permit</em> these sorts of activities to generate mechanical advantages (eg HeroWars might allow me to get a benefit from a Relationship keyword if I have lunch with friends and family, or to get a benefit from resting to heal if I have a Physical keyword like "works best after rest") - but, to reiterate, if you <em>won't</em> rest unless the mechanics mandate it then you are roleplaying someone with a personality disorder.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 4549440, member: 42582"] You seem to be presupposing here that the game mechanics do not make player announcement sufficient for success of action resolution. You seem to be presupposing here that what counts as "smart play" is the same in all RPGs (or at least all versions of D&D). Both presuppositions are contentious. Some 4e mechanics do permit player announcement to be sufficient for success. And smart play in 4e is not the same as in 1st ed AD&D. In particular, in the former game it is sometimes "smart play" for a player to have his/her PC do things that are not necessarily smart from the PC's point of view - the game mechanics are designed to sometimes reward what is, from the point of view of the PC, rashness or excessive flamboyance. The same sort of thinking underlies the hit point mechanics. And I still reiterate - if you are playing an RPG, and there is no mechanical reason not to do certain things to maintain verisimilitude, and you as a player choose not to, and then you are irritated by the lack of verisimilitude - well, you have no one but yourself to blame. But it can be made verisimilitudinous in any event: if you absolutely won't refrain from pushing on to the next tomb because the mechanics don't [i]require[/i] your PC to rest, then in the gameworld your PC is such a driven tomb-looter that no amount of physical debilitation slows him/her down. Presumably your PC is also the sort of sociopath who won't take a break on the weekend to have lunch with friends and family, because there is no game-mechanical advantage to doing that either. I'm not sure I want to play that PC, but I can see that it has a place in the gameworld of D&D. Now I have no objection to an RPG that does [i]permit[/i] these sorts of activities to generate mechanical advantages (eg HeroWars might allow me to get a benefit from a Relationship keyword if I have lunch with friends and family, or to get a benefit from resting to heal if I have a Physical keyword like "works best after rest") - but, to reiterate, if you [i]won't[/i] rest unless the mechanics mandate it then you are roleplaying someone with a personality disorder. [/QUOTE]
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