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<blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8780445" data-attributes="member: 6801228">But once I have the powers of Superman, I can take over and rule a nation. Everything about getting those powers makes me far more likely to rule compared to being someone without powers.I think this gets into a fundamental question though, and is the reason I'm struggling with this discussion. You say the average joe wizard wouldn't be able to &quot;take control&quot; of a nation. But this assumes that the nation already exists and is ruled by a non-magic user. Why? Why would non-magic users be in charge AT ALL. Go back to the earliest days of the first nation states. Who ruled those states? 1) Those who could provide food to their followers2) Those who could defend their lands3) Those who could claim the blessings of the Gods All of those things would be made easier, and be done perhaps even better by magic users. You seem to be assuming a set-up where a nation state already exists, is already ruled by non-magic users and that the magic user comes in with no backing and tried to forcefully oust the legitimate rulers. I'm asking, why is the basis of the government not ALREADY built on magic? As you said earlier, spells like creation and fabricate lead to massive amounts of wealth, which would then be the basis of becoming a noble family, which would then lead to you being in the ruling class. Getting wealth is inherently something that puts you in the ruling class, because wealth represents man-hours of labor, and the wealthy can direct more man-hours than the poor. So if spell-casters are just casually wealthy, they would casually be in the ruling class.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Chaosmancer, post: 8780445, member: 6801228"] But once I have the powers of Superman, I can take over and rule a nation. Everything about getting those powers makes me far more likely to rule compared to being someone without powers. I think this gets into a fundamental question though, and is the reason I'm struggling with this discussion. You say the average joe wizard wouldn't be able to "take control" of a nation. But this assumes that the nation already exists and is ruled by a non-magic user. Why? Why would non-magic users be in charge AT ALL. Go back to the earliest days of the first nation states. Who ruled those states? 1) Those who could provide food to their followers 2) Those who could defend their lands 3) Those who could claim the blessings of the Gods All of those things would be made easier, and be done perhaps even better by magic users. You seem to be assuming a set-up where a nation state already exists, is already ruled by non-magic users and that the magic user comes in with no backing and tried to forcefully oust the legitimate rulers. I'm asking, why is the basis of the government not ALREADY built on magic? As you said earlier, spells like creation and fabricate lead to massive amounts of wealth, which would then be the basis of becoming a noble family, which would then lead to you being in the ruling class. Getting wealth is inherently something that puts you in the ruling class, because wealth represents man-hours of labor, and the wealthy can direct more man-hours than the poor. So if spell-casters are just casually wealthy, they would casually be in the ruling class. [/QUOTE]

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