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<blockquote data-quote="airwalkrr" data-source="post: 5146670" data-attributes="member: 12460"><p>Now I realize a lot of people who post in this forum probably love Pathfinder, but please understand I am not trying to start a flame war.</p><p></p><p>Pathfinder is out. People have been playing it a little while and it seems like Paizo is running strong. I'm happy for them. I really am. Erik Mona and the whole crew there have given me loads of enjoyment over the years with all sorts of products.</p><p></p><p>I have been following the Pathfinder project since they did the open Alpha release. Being a huge fan of Paizo, I converted my D&D 3.5 game and we incorporated the changes into our game with each release. I regularly visited the Paizo message boards to post my comments and exchange ideas on all manner of rules. My group updated when they released the Beta and I even bought a print copy of the Beta rules (partly so I wouldn't have to keep printing stuff myself) and continued to keep up with the changes online. Then they released the final version of the game, after much long waiting and anticipation. I didn't buy it.</p><p></p><p>Oh, I went to my FLGS to check it out. Take a look at what, if any, final changes they made to the Beta. See if there were any interesting nuggets that might make it worth adding to my library as a reference, even if I didn't plan to adopt the rules completely. It was beautiful. The art was edgy. It was well-put together. And it seemed to be a bargain at $50 when D&D 4e was well over twice that for the three core rulebooks alone. But I couldn't get myself to buy it.</p><p></p><p>Here is my line of thought regarding Pathfinder. By the end of the process, a lot of it just seemed unnecessary. They started out saying they were going to continue 3.5 by making it more exciting and fixing the niggling little problems that hadn't been addressed since 2003. I allowed my love of Paizo products to color my impressions of the system all the way up to release, but by the end of the journey I had to admit that it didn't seem like they had fixed much of anything. And their idea of making the game more exciting seemed to be to add a bunch of features to every class (even the ones that worked just fine before). My players were frustrated with it by the end because there just seemed to be too many things going on, and I agreed with them.</p><p></p><p>So I put Pathfinder back on the shelf, and realized my torrid love affair with Paizo was probably at an end. I would still buy some of their system-neutral products from time to time of course, like map packs, maybe even adventures I could convert to other systems. But it would never be the same.</p><p></p><p>I think at the end of the day I realized that just because the people at Paizo are really good at one thing (stories; their writers are some of the most talented people I've ever seen and their adventures have plots that continue to amaze me) doesn't mean that they are good at all things. When it comes to rules, well, I just don't ascribe to the mantra that more is better.</p><p></p><p>Maybe I am off-base because it seems a lot of people are enjoying Pathfinder, and I'm happy for them. But I don't think it is the game for me.</p><p></p><p>I think what I am looking for is someone to explain to me why I'm wrong, because I feel a little jaded after the whole experience. The Pathfinder book is really pretty and I want a reason to add it to my collection, but I just can't seem to find a good one.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="airwalkrr, post: 5146670, member: 12460"] Now I realize a lot of people who post in this forum probably love Pathfinder, but please understand I am not trying to start a flame war. Pathfinder is out. People have been playing it a little while and it seems like Paizo is running strong. I'm happy for them. I really am. Erik Mona and the whole crew there have given me loads of enjoyment over the years with all sorts of products. I have been following the Pathfinder project since they did the open Alpha release. Being a huge fan of Paizo, I converted my D&D 3.5 game and we incorporated the changes into our game with each release. I regularly visited the Paizo message boards to post my comments and exchange ideas on all manner of rules. My group updated when they released the Beta and I even bought a print copy of the Beta rules (partly so I wouldn't have to keep printing stuff myself) and continued to keep up with the changes online. Then they released the final version of the game, after much long waiting and anticipation. I didn't buy it. Oh, I went to my FLGS to check it out. Take a look at what, if any, final changes they made to the Beta. See if there were any interesting nuggets that might make it worth adding to my library as a reference, even if I didn't plan to adopt the rules completely. It was beautiful. The art was edgy. It was well-put together. And it seemed to be a bargain at $50 when D&D 4e was well over twice that for the three core rulebooks alone. But I couldn't get myself to buy it. Here is my line of thought regarding Pathfinder. By the end of the process, a lot of it just seemed unnecessary. They started out saying they were going to continue 3.5 by making it more exciting and fixing the niggling little problems that hadn't been addressed since 2003. I allowed my love of Paizo products to color my impressions of the system all the way up to release, but by the end of the journey I had to admit that it didn't seem like they had fixed much of anything. And their idea of making the game more exciting seemed to be to add a bunch of features to every class (even the ones that worked just fine before). My players were frustrated with it by the end because there just seemed to be too many things going on, and I agreed with them. So I put Pathfinder back on the shelf, and realized my torrid love affair with Paizo was probably at an end. I would still buy some of their system-neutral products from time to time of course, like map packs, maybe even adventures I could convert to other systems. But it would never be the same. I think at the end of the day I realized that just because the people at Paizo are really good at one thing (stories; their writers are some of the most talented people I've ever seen and their adventures have plots that continue to amaze me) doesn't mean that they are good at all things. When it comes to rules, well, I just don't ascribe to the mantra that more is better. Maybe I am off-base because it seems a lot of people are enjoying Pathfinder, and I'm happy for them. But I don't think it is the game for me. I think what I am looking for is someone to explain to me why I'm wrong, because I feel a little jaded after the whole experience. The Pathfinder book is really pretty and I want a reason to add it to my collection, but I just can't seem to find a good one. [/QUOTE]
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