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<blockquote data-quote="seebs" data-source="post: 6752313" data-attributes="member: 61529">Apart from the drops/reduces question (which I don't think is a consistently-used terminology distinction), it seems to me that we have two fundamentally identical triggers: &quot;[the druid] drops to 0 hit points&quot; or &quot;reduces [the target] to 0 hit points&quot;.There's nothing to indicate that one of them means &quot;ends up at 0 hit points after all other procs&quot; and the other means &quot;goes to 0 hit points at all ever&quot;.So if an event can trigger one, that event can also trigger the other.No, it doesn't. It triggers off 0 hit points. If they had meant &quot;triggers off the game world events of unconscious/dead&quot;, they would have written &quot;if this damage knocks you unconscious or kills you&quot;.That's not stated, and it's actually not how I'd interpret it. I'd interpret it as being just like the trope in literature where you knock the shifter out, and they revert, except that they revert less damaged.Agreed.See, I don't think the &quot;result&quot; thing is implied here, exactly. I think, rather, the issue here is that the wild shape (or other polymorph) powers are intended to interrupt damage processing and cause you to restart the damage processing with new circumstances; you apply the remaining damage to a new form, instead of continuing with the existing damage event. So it's not that disintegrate's relying on &quot;final resulting damage&quot;; disintegrate is as-written, just like unconscious/dead-at-zero is as-written, but the shape revert is an interrupt which breaks that.That's simpler and consistent with the rules philosophy that you have relatively straight-forward rules and sometimes one rule trumps another.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="seebs, post: 6752313, member: 61529"] Apart from the drops/reduces question (which I don't think is a consistently-used terminology distinction), it seems to me that we have two fundamentally identical triggers: "[the druid] drops to 0 hit points" or "reduces [the target] to 0 hit points". There's nothing to indicate that one of them means "ends up at 0 hit points after all other procs" and the other means "goes to 0 hit points at all ever". So if an event can trigger one, that event can also trigger the other. No, it doesn't. It triggers off 0 hit points. If they had meant "triggers off the game world events of unconscious/dead", they would have written "if this damage knocks you unconscious or kills you". That's not stated, and it's actually not how I'd interpret it. I'd interpret it as being just like the trope in literature where you knock the shifter out, and they revert, except that they revert [b]less damaged[/b]. Agreed. See, I don't think the "result" thing is implied here, exactly. I think, rather, the issue here is that the wild shape (or other polymorph) powers are intended to interrupt damage processing and cause you to restart the damage processing with new circumstances; you apply the remaining damage to a new form, instead of continuing with the existing damage event. So it's not that disintegrate's relying on "final resulting damage"; disintegrate is as-written, just like unconscious/dead-at-zero is as-written, but the shape revert is an interrupt which breaks that. That's simpler and consistent with the rules philosophy that you have relatively straight-forward rules and sometimes one rule trumps another. [/QUOTE]

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