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<blockquote data-quote="Arial Black" data-source="post: 7350081" data-attributes="member: 6799649">You can describe all those things as 'attacks' (non-game term) as much as you like, but what they are not are 'attacks' as the game term, and the spell is definitely using it as a game term!If we could be so loose with the game term then great! I have a magic sword that gives me +1 to attack! So, +1 to the DC of my breath weapons and spells (as long as the spell does something to the target that it wouldn't like), +1 to all my skill checks that I can insert the word 'attack' into the description of what I'm doing (Athletics? I'll 'attack' that mountain and climb up lickety-split! Animal Handling? Mule-skinning sounds offensive to me! Deception? They definitely don't want to be deceived! Intimidation? Not even a question, +1 for me! Performance? The way I butchered that poem surely gets me that +1! Sleight of Hand? Well, I am invading his personal space!)Thanks, +1 sword! I can't wait to get the Vorpal version so that when I intimidate people their heads fall off!Now, is that all silly and ridiculous? Does pretending that 'attack', even though it is a game term, is not used as a game term when describing the game mechanics, result in the absurd? YES! But that's what you are doing: taking the word 'attack', when clearly used as a game term, and pretending that it's being used as 'natural language'!Invisibility does not end when the target 'does something hostile', it ends when the target casts a spell, makes an attack roll, or takes an action which the rules specifically say counts as an attack! Only 'push' and 'grapple' fall into that category so far.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Arial Black, post: 7350081, member: 6799649"] You can describe all those things as 'attacks' (non-game term) as much as you like, but what they are [b]not[/b] are 'attacks' as the game term, and the spell is definitely using it as a game term! If we could be so loose with the game term then great! I have a magic sword that gives me +1 to attack! So, +1 to the DC of my breath weapons and spells (as long as the spell does something to the target that it wouldn't like), +1 to all my skill checks that I can insert the word 'attack' into the description of what I'm doing (Athletics? I'll 'attack' that mountain and climb up lickety-split! Animal Handling? Mule-skinning sounds offensive to me! Deception? They definitely don't want to be deceived! Intimidation? Not even a question, +1 for me! Performance? The way I butchered that poem surely gets me that +1! Sleight of Hand? Well, I am invading his personal space!) Thanks, +1 sword! I can't wait to get the Vorpal version so that when I intimidate people their heads fall off! Now, is that all silly and ridiculous? Does pretending that 'attack', even though it is a game term, is not used as a game term when describing the game mechanics, result in the absurd? YES! But that's what you are doing: taking the word 'attack', [i]when clearly used as a game term[/i], and pretending that it's being used as 'natural language'! [i]Invisibility[/i] does [b]not[/b] end when the target 'does something hostile', it ends when the target casts a spell, makes an attack roll, or takes an action which the rules [i]specifically say[/i] counts as an attack! Only 'push' and 'grapple' fall into that category so far. [/QUOTE]

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