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Message: <blockquote data-quote="shagadm" data-source="post: 5987568" data-attributes="member: 6689136">First of all I didn't say you can NOT identify a cure light spell. I said that a wizard or any other spellcaster that does NOT have that particular spell in his CLASS spell list, can NOT know details... DETAILS... about the spell. What`s details you ask? Well, the cure lights spell is not a good example but I will try to use it as an example. You don't know how many HP it can cure (1d8+ caster lvl, max +5) and you don't know it has spell resistance. You do know that it is a 1st lvl conjuration spell of the healing type and that it uses positive energy to heal. That`s all. Unfortunately every spellcaster player I have meet so far (including you), will simple look up the spell in the books and find its details (metagaming??). For simple spells like cure light it doesn't matter so much to me but for more complicated spells it does. Thats the reason I no longer tell the player the name of the spell but only the spell level, school, subschool and type of the spell, IF he does NOT have it in his class spell lists.Finally I admitted from the start that this whole thing is a HOUSE RULE of mine. I believe it is based on RAI and RAW but I admit I might be wrong and that's why I introduce it as a house rule. I don't think it cripples casters, because you can still counter it if you succeed on your spellcraft check (if the spell is not on your class spell list, then you probably don't have it prepared to counter it with spell vs spell and you will need to use dispell vs spell, so the informations I give are enough) and in any case the NPCs use the same house rule for your spells so it balances out.Edit-1: As for the other DM that doesn't let you identify a spell that is on your class list if its not on your known spells. I do believe he is crippling casters with limited known spells like sorcerers but if he states its a house rule and not the raw then you cant do much other that tell him you think its an unfair house rule.Edit-2: A non-caster with spellcraft is not useless. He can identify everything he needs to counterspell an incoming caster if he has a wand of dispell and can use it. He can also use the information he gets from a spellcraft to gain some bonuses. For example if he identifies an illusion school spell he gets a bonus on his will save. Other than those benefits I don't know what more could a non-caster ask? what more would he gain, in the few seconds he gets from the time he identifies the spell till the time it takes effect, if he knew that a scorching ray does 4d6 of fire damage, has to hit with a range touch attack, has SR but no save, the caster can have one ray per four levels beyond 3rd lvl but all targets must be within 30 feet of each other and fired simultaneously. And really, could someone that will never cast this spell (unless he multyclass), know all that information??</blockquote>

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