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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Khaalis" data-source="post: 1444771" data-attributes="member: 2167">Within what core rules?  I  am just not seeing your point I guess. Mage Hand is a prerequisite for Arcane Casters because it makes sense to be for flavor. However, there is nothing in the Legerdemain ability that specifically states that it is a Telekinetic spell-like ability. It specifically says it is a "unique talent" and that it is Supernatural in origin. It doesnt say it uses mage hand, nor does it require the casting of the spell.  It is a "flavor" requirement for arcane casters to show a "growth" in their abilities to give the "reason" for the abilities existence in the class to make sense for someone of the arcane persuasion.  Divine casters dont have to worry about that. The PrC can grant them any related ability and it makes sense. Not so for arcane casters. Everything they get in PrC's has to built off of something else they can do.Also, if arcane and divine are as seperatist as you describe, why can some clerics cast invisibility or Stone Skin or any of the other dozens of normally "Arcane" spells?  Clerics aren't arcane casters but some clerics can use arcane spell completion and spell trigger items. How? Why? They have no arcane training... but its a granted ability.  In the same light, clerics are granted "out of class" and even "out of race" abilities all the time. So why wouldnt a cleric be able to learn Ranged Legerdemain?I dont see any reason yet stated as to why a Cleric/Rogue could not be a Trickster.(PS: On a side note, I am not arguing the point for any love of the ability - just for the logic of the statements. I personally think its a pretty crappy ability that wastes class levels, but the build is meant to be a direct mirror of the Core DMG version [for those "balance purists"], which by the DMG's own statement is nothing more than a guideline and example.  In all reality I think the idea should be tweaked to a Specialist Cleric PrC by religion - of which I have the Mask version posted on the WotC FR Boards.)</blockquote>

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