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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 3658476" data-attributes="member: 48965">So you claim it's not a competition for fun...but the DM can be "out-voted"...right...ok.  Everyone's not you and expecting every DM to derive their fun in your one-wayism is just ridiculous. Yeah, the difference is the friends aren't ever told that.  In fact it's never even suggested that the problem could be them or the way they are acting.That's not what I said.  It's valid only in so much that Descent doesn't set up variable expectations in playstyle like D&D does.  If Noah runs a game of Descent he will have no illusions about where his fun should lie, besides his players seem like they want the style it promotes anyway.Didn't miss anything.  My contention was with you touting two paragraphs, out of five, as being what the article was mainly about.  Last time I checked 3/5ths is more than 2/5ths...wait a minute the articles actually ten paragraphs, guessed you missed that, huh? You know what?  It isn't telling him how to get what he wants, and it is about whose fun is more important.  When his players find a magic item some of them want a list of abilities(some aren't even willing to wait for that)...that's it.  Noah apparently derives his enjoyment from the creative aspect...how is he going to get what he wants if they aren't even willing to listen to what the item looks like?  The appearance of the item is relevant, but if you can't give your DM the respect or attention to tell you...what does it matter if it's relevant or not?  He might as well just hand them a piece of paper with a list of it's abilities and call it a day...will he enjoy himself? I seriously doubt it.Or you may only be focusing on the parts of the article that you agree with.No if I've got a friend who talks all the time, is it defeatist to go to a movie I really want to see with another.  I mean I could have a long discourse with my friend, try to get them to see why they should change themselves for me, and go to the movies with my fingers crossed.  Or I could just go to an amusement park or concert on a different day with that friend instead.  Life's to short and sometimes no gaming is better than bad gaming.I agree to disagree...in any social endeavor all participants hold equal responsibility for both their own enjoyment as well as the enjoyment of others.  That's why, especially at an early age, learning to compromise is so important.Good for you, I've gamed with groups I've truly enjoyed...and with those I would never game with again.  I am aware of my preferences as a player and a GM, and just like I wouldn't force someone who hates rap to go to a Eminem concert... I don't think expending energy to try and change people is always the best option.  YMMV of course.Or not...All depends on how important said activity with said people are. You're making some really large blanket assumptions about people who play D&D...Especially since more than one poster has expressed enjoying this type of involvement with their DM's campaign.The funny thing is your also assuming it wasn't relevant.  Perhaps it was relevant to the players who were listening, does that give the others the right, because they aren't the center of attention at this moment, to act the asshat role?  Perhaps the two listening were the only ones interested in doing something other than fighting the next monster...of course if he made all the magic items always relevant to the next monster, he'd probably bore the players who want more out of the game.  Two players didn't even want to hear the abilities they just grabbed the staff...how much more "relevant" can you get than the actual powers of the items.  The more I read it, they just seem like rude players.Uhm...read the first part of the article, then ask me that again.  You know the first part where he explains that, except for two players, the others talk over him and don't pay attention. Like I said two players screamed for the item before they even knew what it did.  It sucks you've never played with a DM who could pull this off well.  If you're ever in Chicago hit me up and I'll show you how it's done.</blockquote>

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